The slippery slope has started

[Bongtrees]

Taken from Spanish newspapers today

Following their electoral win on Sunday, the Socialists now have started to chip away at Spanish constitutions.

The first of these is in the Constitutional Court, where two conservative magistrates - Rodriguez Zapata and Garcia Calvo - have been told that they will be unable to cast their vote in a motion presented by the Partido Popular against the law that would allow the Socialist President of the court - Maria Antonia Casas - from continuing beyond her normal term.

This measure is also expected to affect every single case presented by the PP, and these include the same-sex marriage law, the National Water Plan of the Socialists and even the Catalan statutes of Autonomy.

This is the first time that a decision of this sort has ever been undertaken since Spain became democratic

[Beachcomber]

Is this a surprise?

I think the monarchy is also in the socialist's sights.

It will be a race to see whether they can destroy Spain before the Spanish people see sense and destroy them.

[Alan-LaCala]

I think the monarchy is also in the socialist's sights.

Oh good! Another reason to vote for them.

Alan

[Beachcomber]

You obviously have no knowledge of the events of 23-F otherwise you would not make such vile, ignorant, uninformed remark.

[swerve]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/23-F


Thanks beachy didnt know anything about the 23-f worth reading about though thanks.

[Alan-LaCala]

Wanting to abolish the monarchy is neither vile, ignorant nor uninformed, and has nothing to do with failed coup d'etats.

You are really going to have to get used to the concept Beachcomber that not everyone shares your political views, and that it is legal for people to think independently.

Alan

[gavilan]

In the thread 'Manuel Chaves wins again' ...
Beachcomber wrote that he would want the PP to 'Boost the economy, control inflation, reverse the trend towards unemployment, reduce taxes, increase pensions and spending on healthcare, control illegal immigration, re-establish good relations with the rest of Europe and the USA and take steps to reiterate family values' ...
what I find so interesting is that apart from reducing taxes and the family values thing (and maybe relations with US/Europe) I would not disagree and I would have voted PSOE!

[Beachcomber]

Swerve, it's great that you have checked out an extremely important piece of the modern history of Spain. It's a pity that more people do not take the trouble do so. The Wikipedia entry is fairly accurate if a little abbreviated.

There is an excellent factual account in by King Juan Carlos in 'El Rey' by José Luis de Villalonga and a much more intimate account by Queen Sofía in 'La Reina' by Pilar Urbana in which the personal danger to which the king exposed himself and his family in order to put down the coup is well documented as well as the lengths to which the television technicians went to ensure the king's speech was broadcast directly to the nation without passing through the studios which had been occupied by those involved and who would undoubtedly have cut the transmission if they had had the wherewithal.

Although this happened before I came to live in Spain I was visiting relations in Barcelona at the time and can testify to the fact that the whole country went through a very tense couple of days and although tanks did not appear on the streets in Barcelona as they did in Valencia groups of more than three or four people were being violently disbanded by the military and the Guardia Civil during the night of 23rd/24th February.

It was OK for me. I knew that, if the worst came to the worst, I had somewhere to go, assuming I could get out of the country, but at that moment the entire Spanish population was facing the possibility of another period of military dictatorship and the democracy which the socialists are currently so intent on destroying would, at best, have been delayed by several years and, at worst, would never have arrived at all.

Support for or opposition to the Spanish monarchy is not as polarised as in the United Kingdom. The Spanish royal family live in far less opulence than their British counterparts and you would be hard pressed to find a Spaniard, especially one who is old enough to have vivid memories of this event and the part taken by Juan Carlos, who is in favour of its abolition. The 'Third Republic' can only ever be a pipe dream in the minds of certain politicians.

Unfortunately attempts are being made to obliterate or censor certain periods of Spanish history by means of political interference in school curricula. Hardly the act of a democratic government. History is history and Juan Carlos de Borbón y Borbón, and how he acceded to the throne, is an important and irrevocable part of that history.

[spanish hopes]

In my opinion ' modern' Socialism is no more than back door Communism. I do not like the phrase "Nanny State" as nannies are usually carers. The Socialist/Communist governments of the UK and Spain are not carers, they are CONTROLLERS.
The acceptance of their corruption beggars belief.
Give me Royalty any day rather than the Putin style controllers we have in place at the moment.

[Grouser]

I don't think most socialists would consider the present UK government worthy of the name. It's far too centre right. However for once I agree with SH about the desire to control, as evidenced by the identity card scheme which keeps popping up again and again.

[Travelogic]

In my opinion ' modern' Socialism is no more than back door Communism. I do not like the phrase "Nanny State" as nannies are usually carers. The Socialist/Communist governments of the UK and Spain are not carers, they are CONTROLLERS.
The acceptance of their corruption beggars belief.
Give me Royalty any day rather than the Putin style controllers we have in place at the moment.

Aren't the Royals controlled by government agencies though?
I do agree about the governments though, and the MPs' grumbling about the freedom of information goes some way to strengthen the opinion that they're corrupt *beep*.
Does anyone think Cameron's tactics would be any better?
I personally don't think they could be worse.

[Campo Kenny]

There's loads of "freedom of information" in the UK.
They've lost every *beep* cd they own with everyones details on them ......not many more bits of info to free really.

[spanish hopes]

Does anyone think Cameron's tactics would be any better?
I personally don't think they could be worse.

You are of course right. they couldn't be any worse. He is a Politician so therefore in my opinion is intrinsically a rogue.

Billy Connolly once said that we should never trust anyone who showed an interest in becoming a politician. Look at Governments the world over and see just how right he was.

[Grouser]

Of course they could be worse. He is an old school anti European tory toff for goodness sake.

[spanish hopes]

That doesn't make him a bad person.

Being a thieving sleazy atypical politician who wouldn't recognise the truth if it came up and bit him on the @rse does though.

[ICCSL]

Wanting to abolish the monarchy is neither vile, ignorant nor uninformed, and has nothing to do with failed coup d'etats.

You are really going to have to get used to the concept Beachcomber that not everyone shares your political views, and that it is legal for people to think independently.

Alan

I don't think that Beachcomber impresses his political views on people, he just makes his views clear. The PSOE only won because of the Catalan vote and they voted for them because they believe this government will give them autonomy. It will be interesting to see if they get it (which I doubt). I agree that it is legal for people to think independently but when you see what has happened to this country over the last 4 years it is going to be even more interesting to see where that independence of thought is going to lead us during the next four years (that is of course if we don't have a civil war sooner than the end of their term). Perhaps those people who independently thought that it was a good idea to vote for the PSOE might independently think again, before long, that maybe the country which is on its knees at present is being flushed down the toilet with so much independent thought.

[Grouser]

Agreed Spanish Hopes, it just makes his politics that bit more selfish. However doing stunts like riding a bike to work whilst being followed by a car with your suit and papers in it and sticking one of those useless B&Q wind generators on the roof of your house in order to pretend you have green credentials does tend to expose him as yet another sleaze bag desperate to get his hands on a bit of power.

[Beachcomber]

An article that says it all. I promise I did not write it under a pseudonym:

http://www.isn.ethz.ch/news/sw/details.cfm?ID=18639

[ICCSL]

This article says it all. I have nothing to add except that I have always believed that the prime minister looks like Mr. Bean and it would appear that in international affairs he is viewed as Mr. Bean.

My worry, having lived in Spain for so long, is what is going to bring it all to a head as surely something will. Let us all hope that it is not another civil war because I have no experience of living through any type of war and I have no idea of what would happen to all of us if there is one.

Do you know, Beachcomber?

[Beachcomber]

I have to admit to the same fears.

As I said in a previous post, I was in Spain at the time of the attempted coup d’état in 1981, although not living here full time, and those eighteen hours must rank among the worst of my life.

At the risk of being accused of scaremongering I have to say that many of the people behind that incident still have powerful influence in the country and that discontent with the current situation is bubbling away just under the thin veneer of democracy which has probably become considerably thinner since last Sunday.

Don't be misled by the comic-opera appearance of Antonio Tejero, he was only a figure-head, if you can call him that, and the identities of many of those involved were never known because as soon as they realised that they did not have the support of the king they backed off.

In short, I don't know what would happen in the event of another civil war but no-one should be complacent enough to believe that it could never happen.