No Going Back to UK for British Expats ?

[Retro P]

EU. European Union citizens have the right to live anywhere within the EU including the United Kingdom (if they should feel so inclined).

Beachcomber, I would never willingly disagree with the informed opinion of a lawyer, however on the above point I should clarifythat: EU citizens do not have an automatic right of entry to other member states, the host state can block entry on the grounds of, for example, a serious criminal record, should they choose to research an individuals past (how likely is that?) the host state can also expel and deny re-entry to individuals who have committed serious crime in the host country.

[Pink Lady]

It amazes me how so many of you spend hours of your time 'Britain Bashing'. If you hate it that much why waste so much of your time waffling on about it, get on with your lives!!!!!!!

I for one love the UK and am very proud to be British I wouldn't change my nationality to Spanish for the world !

[BENIDORM]

Pink Lady...Well that makes at least two of us who are proud to be British, I have never wanted to be Spanish or 'go native', however I do my best to integrate, which I do consider important.And even if someone doesn't speak fluent Spanish, it doesn't mean that they cannot become part of a community,
but no-one has to lose their British identity...
I'm not too sure that I would like to live in the UK on a permanent basis, but I still consider myself very British..
However I suspect that many who say that they would never return to UK, probably couldn't anyway, perhaps they are on the 'run', from the authorities or an irate Husband/ Wife, or have had bad experiences there...

Rule Britannia.

Gordon..

[Pink Lady]

I totally agree Gordon that intergrating is very important which I have made a real effort to do ever since we moved here. Your right about some people not going back because they can't. I have met a few dodgey British characters which is part of the community that I do not wish to integrate with! There seem to be alot of expats here with sketchy histories, better off out of Britain as far as I'm concerned!

I feel very lucky that we even have the option to live and travel in so many other countries (a big bonus that comes with being British). I was looking at some figures in National Geographic magazine a while ago that said (I don't remember exact figures) a much greater percentage of Brits are returning to Britain than are leaving, so it can't be all that bad

I don't really understand why the people on this Topic are slating Britain so much yet are so concerned with not being allowed to go back there

[Devils Advocate]

In general the happy people we meet in Spain don't knock Britain, they are happy with their lot and prefer to be there genuinely. We've discovered it's usually the people who financially couldn't return that do the slating and often (as seen on here) calling the UK the YUK

I believe that most people who deride their homeland yet moan about eeking a living in the sun couldn't make it in the UK and have failed there too..........one usually follows the other.
Having said all that to be honest I guess it depends who you mix with. Our circle of "full time" friends over there love Spain obviously but speak the truth about its downsides and the UK's good points.
Normal behaviour in my book and the way I'd like to think we'd behave if we ever did move over full time.
DA

[Lavanda]

Interesting. I think that as a person who spent 30 years paying into the UK system and never getting a bean back in benefits, nor (thankfully) needing the NHS etc. and having spent umpteen years putting into the system through teaching I am ALLOWED to have a say in the UK as I've EARNED that right. However, I do not and would not run the UK down into the ground and have often posted how much I love the UK but hate the government. I lived in Devon. How much nicer could it have been? Yet if I WANT to run the UK down, I reserve that right.

It's always dangerous to generalise. We are all here for different reasons and all bring our own experiences of the UK with us. We now all have experiences of Spain. WE CHOOSE Spain. Or we go back to the UK. The important thing is the choice. However, Devil's Advocate is right. Happy people are happy people and want others to be happy as well. They tend not to do a lot of moaning and groaning. I'm with the happy people.

[mirandamac]

From one who is in the process of moving to Spain - or maybe even France ( ), I've found this topic, and the one about speaking Spanish, very interesting. I've said a few times that we're not wanting to leave England because we hate it. We're very happy here and just feel the need for 'something different' I guess. Of course it's not perfect here. Nowhere is. I have no objections to other nationalies coming here and I love to hear different languages/accents around and to have some different cultures mixing in. And how can I complain when my intention is for us to move to someone else's country? We don't know yet quite where the right place is for us. Maybe like Benidorm we'll end up moving between France and Spain. I blame the restlessness in my on my Irish tinker ancestors.
I get puzzled by the number of people knocking Britain but then moaning about the possibility of not being able to go back. But even more surprised at the numbers of British IN Spain who do nothing (it seems) but moan about Spain and the Spanish.
I have no idea how well I'll settle, wherever we end up but I do know that if it doesn't work out it won't be for the want of trying and nor will it be the fault of the French or Spanish. It will simply be because it's not the right place for me.

[BENIDORM]

Oh Dear, I seem to have stirred up a bit of a Hornets Nest with my posting.

I never intended to upset anyone,SORRY EVERYONE... and I really value the right to have differing opinions,I've said many times that I really love living in Spain, and believe me I've had a rough time here, but it hasn't deterred me, at the same time I love the UK, and find myself torn between the two countries.
I do get fed up of reading the two 'camps' knocking each country, almost 'tit for tat', if you are happy where you live...great, make the most of it..

Life is too short to waste time having a go at each other,

Friendship and Peace...Please.

Gordon ...

[Devils Advocate]

Hornets nest? It's just a normal debate with people politely putting their views from what I can see.
DA

[Lavanda]

Yes. This debate is A.Com at it's best. Considered and measured exchanges of ideas and experiences. It's a long time since something this serious and weighty and respectful of other posters posts has been on the site. A good topic, Benidorm. A good debate. No apology needed.

[mirandamac]

Can't see any hornets around Gordon!!! As I said, I've found it interesting so don't apologise.

[Julie]

Getting back to the uni fees, i don't understand why one would expect the uni to be fee free, we are British residents and had to pay the fees for our son to go to uni, so I would of thought it should be the same for a ex pat.

As for the rest of the topic, its the weather that atracts me to Spain, anyone reading the spanish papers or watching the tv, will know they have their fair share of problems as do the Brits, having said that, I think a lot of brits wear rose coloured glasses and haven't got a clue what is really happening around them, but live and let live

[Paula]

If I were to be told that in the future I would not be accepted back in UK then I would most definitely leave here tomorrow
OH and myself still have the odd argument about keeping a house in England and all the extra expense that gives, and it is quite a considerable expense. But I would never have moved here if I couldn't keep a foot in both camps. Which I guess says that I am not 100% happy with either country as a place to live fulltime. I like the security of having a home in the UK, I also like the lifestyle we have in Spain and most importantly to me, the weather.
I hold my hands up and say that I was one of those people that became very disenchanted with the UK, though after living here for nearly 8 years now, I do realise that there were many things I took for granted and didn't fully appreciate.
Both places have lots of fors and againsts, and I think it depends much on your personal circumstances as to how much you enjoy life in either place.

[Lavanda]

Exactly, Paula. We can CHOOSE. We are lucky.

[katy]

It is not just A.Com that likes to slate the UK. I read a world ex-pat forum and they all seem to spend their time quoting bad things that have happened in the UK from the Daily Mail etc whilst knowing little of the day to day affairs of the country they are living in. I wonder how many of those living in Andalucia would be here if the climate was the same as the UK and we had to live in inner city Malaga or similar!

[chrissiehope]

I think the key is integration - do what is needed to integrate with whatever community you find yourself in. I spent 4 years in the Philippines (OK it was 20 years ago now !), and for the first 2 of those we lived away from the main brit expat community (cheaper accom). At first I felt very isolated and looked forward to the monthly meetings for brit wives (which I swore before I went I would never go to !). Because we were living the 'expat' lifestyle (posh house, maids etc), we didn't really get to know many locals except the staff, but I made a point of trying to learn some of the local language, and the staff felt comfortable enough with us that we were invited to a christening party held in a shack !

Because we lived so far away from the British School, I put the kids in a local Montessori, and I was so happy with the education they got that even when we moved to the main expat area & thus nearer the school, I kept them in the Montessori system. They were usually the only British kids there (tho some were mixed race), and they mixed with all nationalities including middle to upper class Filipinos. Other brit wives / mothers found this very hard to understand, but it made my kids confident & self-reliant, and they were learning the language (tho they've now forgotten it all - I haven't !!)

Some aspects of life there (in the capital) were incredibly infuriating, but you took a deep breath and carried on. One Christmas I wrote a skit for a brit wives party, about the silly things that would happen regularly - I considered the content carefully, and even the waiters were laughing, so I clearlly hadn't offended them - they obviously found things as irritating as we did !

Sorry, I seem to have rambled on a bit here but I guess what I'm trying to say is you can't live a little isolated life overseas and still get the most from the experience, you have to chuck yourself in at the deep end and get thoroughly immersed - with a bit of commonsense & understanding you can have a wonderful time

[Jool]

My main beef with the UK, and it may well apply to other EU nationals who live away from their native country, is that we STILL pay taxes in the UK on OH´s pension, no choice as he was ex govt employee, yet we are not entitled to use the NHS there...........if there is supposed to be free movement in the EU then it needs to be genuinely free and there need to be more reciprocal arrangements.... instead we, or more specifically he, is discriminated against and has to pay out twice for health care, pending becoming a UK State pensioner......... (well he gets it via me as my dependant as I pay in to the system but that is not true for many people and means I have to keep working until he is fully retired)

Also I would like the choice - I still have a house in the UK as I want to keep my options open as you never know what may happen over here.........I share Beachcomber´´s perspective on this one, and whilst I have no plans to go back there are some things I miss from time to time......

[peteroldracer]

Maybe it's me, but I don;t see anything unfair in your situation, jool.
Your husband has chosen to retire early - i.e. before state retirement age, so he will be paying much less into the state system than if he had worked his full term. He is, as you say, entitled to get treatment in Spain, paid for by the NHS in Britain because of what you have paid, and if you go back for a visit, and get a Spanish EHIC card (free, and easy) you will be covered for treatment in the UK - or anywhere else in Europe, ultimately paid for by the UK! It will cost you or him nothing.
If people choose to retire early and do not have anyone to be dependent on, then surely they are not so stupid as to not take this into account when deciding to retire and move abroad? It is one of those factors to be taken into account.
As those of us who have chosen to move away from the UK are not paying any UK VAT, income tax (except on governement pensions) or anything else into the exchequer, I don't think anyone has the right to expect anything more than an old age pension and health cover when of pensionable age. We get more than that, and for one, I am grateful.

[Lavanda]

Yes. Sorry Jool. I can't quite see what point you are making. All this 'foot in both camps' business is something we considered - briefly. It got too expensive and was unsettling and we never went back to the UK much anyway. All the family want to come to us all the time. We sold everything up in the UK and all our money, time, energy and plans are involved with our life here. Perhaps that's the answer to 'making it work' here?

Would you consider getting married but keep a boyfriend on the side just in case the marriage didn't work out? You might, but might it not be better to make the marriage work instead?

[BENIDORM]

Thanks everyone for contributing to this topic, which at one point I thought might turn into a bit of a 'Battlefield', at times I think some statements can be a bit below the belt, however it has been a lively debate, which could run on because of the many differing views of members.

It has interested me to see that, like myself, many forum members have settled in Spain after having previously being expats in other countries.I do find the stories very interesting, as I'm sure many other members do.
I sincerely hope that everyone can live long and happy lives, where-ever they end up 'hanging their hats'.

Regards, Gordon