What do the Spanish think about a Brexit?

[markwilding]

Britain didn't have a complete collapse of it's civil Engineering industries. Britain's Housing proplem is the opposite of Spain's, Not enough as apposed to too many

It is estimated that 16 countries would like to leave if given a chance of a referendum. I think Spain wouldn't have had so deep a recession if not in the Euro. I also remember steep increases in prices when they ditched the peseta. .

Most of this is pure conjecture. There's no way we are able to know this.

Remember, apart from the banking crisis, A lot of Spain's problem were of their own making. The corruption and housing crisis would have happened anyway.

[markwilding]

You can't stop the rudeness can you. I knew what I was talking about. As I said, OFF TOPIC

Unbelievable, I'm rude?????
I'm sorry you don't agree with me. But every time you post some I don't agree with, I will post my opinion. It is a forum after all.

[katy]

6 of these you posted isn't an opinion. My opinion is it is rude

[El Cid]

Katy is right. Many of these posts are off topic.

Please get back to the original question. Further off topic posts will be deleted.

Sid

[markwilding]

Back on topic then,
I've asked various professional people what they think of Brexit. All of them said they hadn't really thought about it very much but would prefer the UK to stay in as we are an important leading member of the EU.

it seems as though Thursday, 23 June is the day

[katy]

I have just read an article in El Pais. If you want to know what the Spanish think there are 750+ comments. A few sensible ones but the majority accuse the UK of blackmail
Lots of misconceptions. Many seem to thing we get free health etc. In Spain. A few have said that Spain should treat the English the same and not give them free health care...eh Another said UK NHS is rubbish as you have to pay for your artificial hip. One says he saw an advert in an expat paper which said buy an apartment in Vera and get free health care. Top was stop offering jobs to the English Obviously I didn't read them all but this was the general pattern.

[flyeogh]

Just to add to the general situation I'm just 20 mins by boat from Cadiz so not in el campo. The desperation for work here is very obvious.

I've used two builders, plumber, electrition, gas/boiler man and two plasters in the last weeks. Service has been instant as none have sufficient work.

These guys, along with most of my largely unemployed family have no sympathy for the EU. But that said they have little hope of anything. They really see no light at the end of the tunnel.

Another sadness for me is the little bar on the sea front. He didn't open again this month because he can't afford the autonomo!!!

Against that background they do not have a view on Brexit and don't actually care. They politely say "lucky you" when the possibility is mentioned.

[markwilding]

I don't know who you ae asking but that's not the response I'm getting. It seems that Spain has finally woken up to the fact that there's a real possibility that the UK will leave the EU.

Two out of three this morning told me it will be a big mistake. the other hadn't thought about it.

[flyeogh]

Mark I know it can be tough to get into details with the spanish (and I'm not talking about language) but

I assume they mean a big mistake for the UK. But how would they know and why would they care? Or are they saying it would be a big mistake for the EU to let the UK go?

I see in the Hungarian press "Hungarians working in Britain can say goodbye to part of their welfare benefits... but they lose even more if supporters of quitting win".

Tomasz Bielecki, Brussels correspondent of Poland's liberal Gazeta Wyborcza, agrees that migrant workers like the Poles "will pay most for Mr Cameron's compromise", but concludes that "if it keeps Britain in the EU, it's a price worth paying"

And there is debate starting about the UK going could lead others to look for a better deal if not going the same way.

If I was Spanish my concern would be that the UK is a positive contributor to the EU. What cuts will occur to make up the short fall and will they impact Spain?

And how will it impact young Spaniards heading to the UK to look for work?

I find it interesting to note that the UK population represents more than 12.5% of the EU population. But if you look at the UK as a percentage of buying power what would that number grow to?

Have no problem with Spaniards being concerned for us Brits but if I was them I'd worry about things nearer home.

But fascinating stuff watching history unfold before our eyes.

[markwilding]

Believe or not I have all the concerns you mention but for the UK leaving.
How can British workers losing rights in other Eu countries be beneficial?

[masterob]

Mark, I can understand your concern but, quite frankly, Brits working in other EU Countries are not the concern of voters in the UK. Harsh but reality.

[markwilding]

I disagree,
It's one of the fundamentals of membership. Pro EU voters will see it as an important benefit that might be lost.

I am not concerned for me. I have no ulterior motive. My right to live and work in Spain does not depend on the EU .

[flyeogh]

Mark I don't see why you think that is important. You are talking about a minimal percentage of people.

To work in Europe most brits would need to speak at least one foreign language. Sadly they don't. And the truth is that those who offer special skills and want to work in the EU will not be impacted.

It is jobs at home that will matter.

[markwilding]

That's basically the problem with the Brexits. You only see things from a negative view point. What the cost to the UK is while totally disregarding the benefits.

Over a million people is not insignificant and how do you know how many speak second languages? Because of immigration the UK has a high level of bilingual speakers.

Many multinational companies use English as their in house language even in Spain. Move away from the Costas and a much higher percentage speak Spanish.

I watched the high priest of UKIP telling BBC viewers how he'd resolve the Calais crisis if France decide to stop blocking refugees. He'd send them back through the tunnel. What a joke!

[katy]

Even bigger joke is letting them in

[Pamela1]

Mark, I can understand your concern but, quite frankly, Brits working in other EU Countries are not the concern of voters in the UK. Harsh but reality.

Im afraid you are right...

[markwilding]

Oh, so how will that work then?

[flyeogh]

Mark you accuse Brexiters of viewing the argument from one side but then it appears to me that you proceed to not only view it from one side but with a very limited scope.

The reality is in or out life will go on. And whether in or out things will not remain as they are which makes deciding even harder for those like me still weighing up the short and long term pros and cons.

However the idea that leaving the EU will leave millions on multi-lingual brits barred from the EU and without jobs is I think as crazy as some of the things offered by UKIP.

quote] and how do you know how many speak second languages?[/quote]

Many studies have been carried out (including by the EU) but you seem to be missing something here. First for business you need a high level of fluency; more than just asking about the weather. You then need to be in an environment where you can maintain your language level. And finally business needs a language focus to supply a pool of resource. If you look at Belgium as an example to get a job as a good adminmistrator you need an absolute minimum of three languages - but just not any three languages but three specific languages. So an influx of immigrants speaking random languages of the world, and a million or so with holiday french/spanish may be culturally interesting but not economically very interesting.

[markwilding]

It appears to you that way because this is a forum and it is limiting.

I know life will go on and The UK would survive. I also realise that the EU is no way perfect.
But weighing up the pros and con, I see being in is better that being out.

The point about how many Brits speak a different language was a reponse to your observation that Brits would need to speak at least one foreign language and that is a red herring. It's actually not relevant because business tends to be conducted in English anyway.

I also speak Spanish, you are not the only one who is married to someone from here, so I'm well aware of my limitations and abilities in the language and what's required. Being able to speak many languages would not be a priority for that many skilled jobs, apart from your example, there can't be many more.

The main point of my argument is that any agreement with other EU countries would have to be reciprocal. If Spain and The UK don't come to an agreement, British people wanting to work in Spain will lose out( The Spanish will as well but I'm talking from a British point of view). If they do then nothing changes and as far as Spain is concerned, we won't have control over our borders with them and nothing changes.

[flyeogh]

The point about how many Brits speak a different language was a reponse to your observation that Brits would need to speak at least one foreign language and that is a red herring. It's actually not relevant because business tends to be conducted in English anyway.

So these European based employees will live in English speaking gettos and be unable to communicate with fellow workers. And their children will presumably be taught in International schools. And their partners spend their time in english speaking coffee mornings.

Mark that doesn't add up.

It might work for short contracts needing a specific skill but not for anything else.

When I do business in France or Spain I use interpreters who have local business knowledge (even in Spain despite my spanish being very good). If I didn't the negotiations would be very one sided. But I also do it out of respect for my clients and I can assure you it goes a long way.

And this raises an interesting concern. If we are going to stay in the EU we need to commit to it and take an active positive role. If we are not willing to do that then I believe we are better out.

As of now bad feeling towards the EU seems to be growing and if that trend continues I will almost certainly vote for exit.