"amnesty" for illegal andalucian homes

[anis]

This was announced yesterday and I have quoted from Spanish property insight today. They have said it is not an amnesty as such but seeems to look very much like one ?

“In some cases it will be a regularisation that answers to town halls through town plans, and in other cases it will come at the request of individual owners,” Griñán told the Andalucian parliament.

The only homes that won’t be legalised are those built on specially protected land and areas at risk of flooding.

According to the Junta, there are 300,000 homes with planning problems in Andalucia, but others like the left-wing party Izquiera Unida say the figure is more like 400,000.

There will be no more problems in future because it is now “practically impossible” to build illegally in Andalucia, claims Griñán. “We are not going to let our guard down,” he said.

[Jool]

It conveniently neglects to mention the rest which is that it is the property owners/purchasers who will pay for the infra structure on the basis that everyone in an urban property has paid for it so therefore the rich guiris should as well........................if only!!!!

The full bill will be announced and finalised in the Autumn just a few months before the elections, now there IS a coincidence............

[knowal]

I can't help feeling that this is a load of political cobblers.
It will end up with a multi €,000 bill for "legalisation" at which time the owners will be presented with paperwork, which their developers promised them nearly a decade ago.
The developers will be laughing in the bars, driving away drunk in their Mercedes, never being stopped by the Guardia.

...or am I just being a tad cynical?

[Beachcomber]

The government coffers are empty and so, presumably, are the back pockets of the politicians so this is just a way of charging people through the nose to resolve problems that they should never have been led into by corrupt lawyers, architects, developers, estate agents and bureaucrats in the first place.

Some lawyers who were responsible for knowingly allowing their clients to purchase illegal properties are already taking a second bite at the cherry by offering 'regularisation' services. Just have a look through the local English language rags.

A cynic is what an idealist calls a realist.

[julian]

"to resolve problems that they should never have been led into by corrupt lawyers, architects, developers, estate agents and bureaucrats in the first place"


seems everyone was responsible..except of course the brits who actually built the illegal houses, they were all led into it.

[annfoto]

The only 2 illegal houses that I know about near me were built by Spanish builder's and sold to Brits who both used the builder's lawyer
One of them still doesn't have an electricity meter 8 years on.
When we were looking at property in 2002 the only things estate agents wanted to sell us was brand new villas in the campo, none of them built by Brits. Our desire for a small established fruit farm with irrigation water and a small house needing some updating saved us from falling into that trap along with doing some research before parting with any money.

[Beachcomber]

Yes, exactly. Of course, there are some people who would prefer to have us believe that the poor lawyers, architects, promoters estate agents and politicians etc. are the victims of unscrupulous, predominantly elderly British pensioners who were intent on forcing these people to sell them illegal properties.

[julian]

do you really not remember the time when the brits were building houses in the campo knowing perfectly well that what they were building either did not have a licence, or did not have a licence to match what they were building?..many of them built, then later sold to other guiris, at significant profit......... but all that is best brushed under the carpet now...no brits knew anything and they were all led into it........selective memory rules !!
of course many did not know, but many did.

[knowal]

do you really not remember the time when the brits were building houses in the campo knowing perfectly well that what they were building either did not have a licence, or did not have a licence to match what they were building?..many of them built, then later sold to other guiris, at significant profit......... but all that is best brushed under the carpet now...no brits knew anything and they were all led into it........selective memory rules !!
of course many did not know, but many did.

The Spanish know that this is true, and will use it against others, whether or not they had guilty knowledge.

[julian]

wll at least the spanish know it´s true, seems that none of the brits do..maybe too much scotch whisky has faded our british memories.

[Beachcomber]

do you really not remember the time ...

I certainly remember a time when a small minority of British people only listened to what they wanted to hear.

I know someone with several years experience in the purchase of Spanish property who tried to advise a number of people not to buy this or that property because the paperwork was not in order but because they were being assured by a self-proclaimed 'prestigious' firm of lawyers with branches (now defunct) 'all over Andalucía and in London' that the property was perfectly legal and safe for them to purchase they went ahead and did so.

My friend was also very forcibly 'advised' by local lawyers that he/she was not a lawyer, did not understand how the Spanish property purchasing system worked (ie screw the punter for all of the their money, before moving on to the next victim) and NOT to interfere in their lucrative bandwagon jumping, business.

The people who did listen are now very thankful that they did and the ones that did not, at least those that are still here, now admit that they wish they had done so.

[Jool]

Over here in the province of Almeria the vast majority of problems were caused by spanish or english builders selling to expats, but in key areas such as Allmanzora the majority were built by spanish builders/locals who saw a cash cow.........I have seen the distress a lot of these issues have caused and find it pretty low and offensive when people on forums seek to blame the british, yes a few did take the law in to their own hands but the vast majority in this area (cannot speak for CDS) did not do so and were seriously mis-led by solicitors. Those solicitors have not learned we are wiser now as they now offer "regularising" services to those same people they assured years ago in telling them it was all legal.

I personally know of one case where a relative of mine who worked for a legal spanish builder, SL and still in existence now with the same name, sent a client to a solicitor, that solicitor told the client that the property they liked was definitely not legal (on urban land and was actually legal) and then proceeded to persuade them to buy another property that coincidentally happened to be owned by her relative, brother or cousin cannot remember which now, but guess which one REALLY was illegal.

[julian]

"vast majority of problems were caused by spanish or english builders"

"I find it pretty low and offensive when people on forums seek to blame the british"

so it´s ok for you to blame the english, but it´s low and offensive for anyone to blame the british..

GGMS

[Jool]

but in key areas such as Almanzora the majority were built by spanish builders/locals who saw a cash cow.

Hardly hundreds of english or british builders is it as you state Julian - I do get sickened by other expats who make sweeping statements about all of Andalucia, consistently blame the incomers, or the guiris for many of the problems when the REAL and FUNDAMENTAL problem is the spanish administration, or rather lack of proper governmental administration, at local, regional and national levels. These bureaucratic corrupt leeches will latch on to comment like yours and report that even other english blame their fellow countrymen for the problems and illegal buildings, when in fact those who may have rushed out in to the countryside are a minority and certainly get no sympathy from me BUT the VAST MAJORITY of proven cases (checked out by organisations like AUAN, AUN etc) agree that it was nothing other than a blatant rip off against foreigners and naiive spanish (yes some natives were affected too). If Andalucia was a genuine transparent democracy (not in my lifetime for sure) you would have a case but it is not, and you are again doing non spanish affected property owners a HUGE dis-service by making such statements and feeding the greedy bureaucrats who will feast on your blinkered and biased words.

[julian]

"Hardly hundreds of english or british builders is it as you state Julian !

where did I state the amount of english or british builders? bit hot over your way today is it ??it was you blaming the english builders not me.



"the REAL and FUNDAMENTAL problem "..the real and fundalmental problem were the people ,both foreigners and locals who built with no licence, or built too many m2, or bought a house that had more m2 than on the paperwork.......if you were told it was ok to go and shoot your neighbour instead of denouncing him would you go ahead and shoot him thinking it was all quite legal?

[katy]

The main culprits, British Estate agents and spanish builders. Not many spanish were caught out...they knew what was happening when the relatives and friends of mayors turned into builders overnight. They stood on the sidelines and hoped their Paco would get a job on site! Most of the british agents didn't know anything about spanish property law, many had only been in the country a few weeks and declared themselves "property experts"
I would have thought that paying a lawyer 1% of the purchase price would have overiden the above problems....obviously it didn't!

[julian]

who is the culprit when a person shoots another person, with a gun, with no licence...

is the manufacturer of the gun responsible?
is the authority which issues gun licences responsible?
is the seller of the gun responsible?
is the mayor of the village where the shooting took place responsible?

if the guiris had not been prepared to build nor buy houses with no licences, or with licences that didn´t match what had been built then no builders would not have built the houses in the first place.

[katy]

Why do you use the word "guiri" if you were black would you call yourself a *beep*?

Beep should be NIG ger

[rt21]

I think you are spot on Katy with your comments about the lawyers. They have a lot to answer for.

Richard

[julian]

I don´t mind being called a guiri,I am a guiri... it´s not an insult, and blacks do not mind being called black..you´ve been in the uk too long now katy and have gone PC !!!!
I´m a white and the blacks are black....al pan pan y al vino vino

why didn´t you pull Jool up for calling us guiris earlier in the thread ?