Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

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esteponaman
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Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby esteponaman » Thu Dec 29, 2016 8:25 pm

Form 210 The self assessment, imputed rental income tax is only payable by non residents.

Has anyone ever asked why?

A Spanish resident with a second property unused/vacant /not let is not penalised with an "imputed rental income tax.

Surely , this is an obvious case of discrimination of EU residents whom are not resident in Spain but are Spanish property owners.

The EU forced Spain to treat non resident 's rental income in the same way as a Spanish resident.

Why is it different for the Imputed rental income tax?

El Cid
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby El Cid » Thu Dec 29, 2016 8:45 pm

What you say is incorrect.

Imputed income tax is paid by residents if they have a second property. Habitual residences are exempt from this tax and, of course, a property owned by a non resident cannot possibly be a habitual residence.

The EU did not force Spain to tax residents and non residents the same tax on rental income as residents have always paid the tax on second properties. I think you may be confusing this with changes that were made to CGT by the EU, but even then, residents get total exemption on their habitual residences if over 65 which non residents do not.

Incidentally, most residents pay far more income tax in Spain than they would do in the UK

Sid

maureenscot
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby maureenscot » Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:58 pm

Worth checking with Euro lawyer

wollie
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby wollie » Thu Dec 29, 2016 10:10 pm

I think i would rather pay Spanish taxes than pay the "euro liar"

El Cid
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby El Cid » Thu Dec 29, 2016 10:59 pm

maureenscot wrote:Worth checking with Euro lawyer


Why?

Sid

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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby Beachcomber » Thu Dec 29, 2016 11:32 pm

No need to check with anyone, especially not a lawyer (Euro or otherwise). What Sid says is correct and the post by Esteponaman is ill-informed (to put it politely). I submit my tax return as a fiscal resident of Spain and I pay imputed tax on my apartment on the coast and on my house in the UK, neither of which are rented out.

If you would like to read all about it you can do so here:

https://www.boe.es/buscar/pdf/2006/BOE- ... lidado.pdf

Article 85 on page 68

What the EU forced Spain to do was allow non-residents who pay tax on actual rental income to claim the same allowances and expenses as a resident providing they are fiscal residents of an EU member state and can produce a certificate of fiscal residnce issued by their tax authority.

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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby Miro » Thu Dec 29, 2016 11:54 pm

esteponaman wrote:Form 210 The self assessment, imputed rental income tax is only payable by non residents.

Has anyone ever asked why?


Could it be because form 210 is only used by non-residents? Fiscal residents use a different form, but as already stated, they pay the same tax on any properties that are not their habitual residence. I paid it on a storage unit I owned in another building.
Don't worry about what people think, they don't do it very often

"Acquiring a dog may be the only opportunity a human ever has to choose a relative," Mordecai Siegal 1935-2010.

Miro
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby Miro » Thu Dec 29, 2016 11:58 pm

wollie wrote:I think i would rather pay Spanish taxes than pay the "euro liar"


Why?
Would you like to pay mine, then? :lolno:
Don't worry about what people think, they don't do it very often

"Acquiring a dog may be the only opportunity a human ever has to choose a relative," Mordecai Siegal 1935-2010.

El Cid
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby El Cid » Fri Dec 30, 2016 9:11 am

Miro wrote:
Fiscal residents use a different form,


It is included in the normal resident's Renta annual tax declaration.

Sid

esteponaman
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby esteponaman » Fri Dec 30, 2016 11:06 am

Thank you all for the clarification. It was always my impression that everyone paid the Imputación de Rentas Inmobiliarias , but a conversation with a Spanish person over Christmas convinced me otherwise. Also the FORM 210 is just for non residents and this convinced me more.
But now as I realise that the residents use another form.

El Cid wrote:It is included in the normal resident's Renta annual tax declaration.


At least I was correct in relation to the declared rental income received from properties of non resident owners

Beachcomber wrote:What the EU forced Spain to do was allow non-residents who pay tax on actual rental income to claim the same allowances and expenses as a resident providing they are fiscal residents of an EU member state and can produce a certificate of fiscal residnce issued by their tax authority.

Miro
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby Miro » Fri Dec 30, 2016 11:18 am

esteponaman wrote:a conversation with a Spanish person over Christmas convinced me otherwise.


Never assume that a Spaniard knows what they're talking about or, more importantly, that they follow the rule of law.
e.g: The only Spaniard I know who has overseas assets (and they're quite substantial, including a villa in Palm Beach Florida) was totally dismissive of the 720 when it was introduced, laughing it off and saying he had no intention whatsoever of complying. As a point of interest, this individual's sister used to be the mayor of our town! :crazy:
Don't worry about what people think, they don't do it very often

"Acquiring a dog may be the only opportunity a human ever has to choose a relative," Mordecai Siegal 1935-2010.

El Cid
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby El Cid » Fri Dec 30, 2016 12:21 pm

Beachcomber explained that all second properties are liable for this tax, and noted that it also applied to his property in the UK.


It is important to remember this if you, as many expats do, own a property outside Spain. Frankly, not a lot of people are aware of this, but it has become much more important now since the Form 720 Asset Declaration came into effect.

In the past, not declaring the imputed income would have probably gone unnoticed, but since you now have to declare overseas property on Form 720, the tax office is now aware that you own a property and it is simple for them to cross check with your Renta declaration to see if you have paid the tax.

Of course, there is no Catastral value to use, but the valuation normally is 1.1 % of 50% of the original purchase price and the tax is whatever the current rate is that applies to your income in Spain.

Sid

Miro
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby Miro » Fri Dec 30, 2016 12:38 pm

Those (Spanish fiscal residents) who are unaware that they should be paying imputed income tax on a UK property, probably also never filed a 720, so probably a moot point!
Don't worry about what people think, they don't do it very often

"Acquiring a dog may be the only opportunity a human ever has to choose a relative," Mordecai Siegal 1935-2010.

wollie
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby wollie » Sat Dec 31, 2016 6:56 am

Miro wrote:
wollie wrote:I think i would rather pay Spanish taxes than pay the "euro liar"


Why?
Would you like to pay mine, then? :lolno:


No, I do not pay my own I am exempt... I think?
I hope them spies from America not looking in here...

Miro
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby Miro » Sat Dec 31, 2016 10:46 am

wollie wrote: I am exempt... I think?


:roll: :crazy: :roll:
Sounds like material for another thread....but probably best not go there!
Don't worry about what people think, they don't do it very often

"Acquiring a dog may be the only opportunity a human ever has to choose a relative," Mordecai Siegal 1935-2010.

wollie
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby wollie » Sat Dec 31, 2016 2:43 pm

"if its not broke don't fix it"

Miro
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Re: Why is it that only non residents have to pay the imputed rental income tax?

Postby Miro » Sat Dec 31, 2016 3:06 pm

But if you don't know if it's broke or not, don't you worry about finding out the hard way some day? I think my car's engine has oil in it....but I'd rather check before going on a long journey than risk finding out when it's too late.
Don't really want to get into this, or let the thread drift, but why do you think you're "exempt" from paying your taxes? Personally, I would be about 2 grand a year better off if I was tax resident in the UK. Of course, if I was evading taxes, whether I am in Spain or the UK makes no difference!
Don't worry about what people think, they don't do it very often

"Acquiring a dog may be the only opportunity a human ever has to choose a relative," Mordecai Siegal 1935-2010.


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