Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?.Remain in Spain!!!

Do you have a query on how to get things done in Andalucia, where to find things, who to call? Find out by posting and hear about others experiences.
BENIDORM
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 3542
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:15 pm
Location: Granada Province

Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?.Remain in Spain!!!

Postby BENIDORM » Mon Mar 13, 2017 4:11 pm

There seems to be a lot of indecision around at the moment, because of Brexit, with regard to what to do , stay in Spain or go back to UK.
For some it seems attractive to pack up and go back to UK, understandable, but from my personal experiences and observations probably not such a good idea.
Anyone who has lived in Spain for say 6 or more years would find it a very different UK from the one they left, and probably more importantly the person is very different , living within a different culture and a complete change of lifestyle certainly changes peoples personalities.
So, some may find that they would be better off in UK, but probably because they never actually succeeded in integrating properly in Spain, circumstances can dictate obviously, so not always the fault of the individual.
I personally have no intention of returning to UK and would have to be probably carried kicking and screaming back if my circumstances forced me to go , and as pensioners I still believe that my wife and I are better staying in Spain, even if at some point we have to adapt our lifestyle.
During our time in Spain ( since 1989 ) we have witnessed many new people arriving and some returning quickly and others only returning because of financial problems or loss of partner etc., but I know many people who have lived in Spain for many years and of course most will have had problems, including us,but have managed to resolve them and now live quite a comfortable life in Spain.
I do have to say that my thoughts and observations are really for anyone who is receiving regular guaranteed income, ie pensions, it's a different story for younger people who will have to work, much more difficult-but certainly not impossible.

I wonder how many other members are determined to carry on in Spain or have doubts ?
Regards,
Gordon
Last edited by BENIDORM on Tue Mar 14, 2017 12:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
gerryh
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 6611
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2008 6:17 pm
Location: Cajiz, Malaga

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?

Postby gerryh » Mon Mar 13, 2017 4:16 pm

We have been here for 13 years.
In Feb we went back to the UK for a few days. Only the fifth time we have been back to the UK.
As you say, things change, but it reinforced our decision to stay in Spain.
Can't think of any reason to go back.
Cheers
Gerry
Gerry Harris

anyroads
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 2044
Joined: Tue Apr 04, 2006 8:53 pm
Location: Hampshire, UK, Lebrija

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?

Postby anyroads » Mon Mar 13, 2017 4:40 pm

Brexit or not...

Nothing will change. Same same....

anyroads

BENIDORM
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 3542
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:15 pm
Location: Granada Province

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?

Postby BENIDORM » Mon Mar 13, 2017 6:14 pm

Gerry I thought that you would be staying. :thumbup:
But would you ever consider moving house to somewhere else in Spain, where you could walk to shops / bars etc, instead of having to rely on your vehicle ?
I ask because 2 people I've spoken with stated that they were thinking of leaving because of their age and they rely on their cars and don't live near enough to walk to amenities , I did point out that it would probably be easier to just move in Spain...they are considering that now...sometimes I think that the easiest option is not even thought about !!

Anyroads...I agree...apart from the Exchange rate and as you are an 'expert' can you make any predictions as to when we might get a better rate ? :?

Regards,
Gordon

User avatar
gerryh
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 6611
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2008 6:17 pm
Location: Cajiz, Malaga

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?

Postby gerryh » Mon Mar 13, 2017 6:25 pm

My wife's eyesight is slowly deteriorating.
She said that if ever she couldn't drive, we have a car each that we need where we live, then we would have to move somewhere that is on a bus route and where she could walk to the shops.
Problem is our cats would probably not like to live near a road. They have the run of open space here in the campo.
My only real concern of living here is the falling exchange rate.
We are OK at the moment but if it got significantly worse we might be struggling a bit.
Cheers
Gerry
Gerry Harris

Lyric
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 2004
Joined: Fri May 16, 2008 12:36 pm
Location: Torrox Campo

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?

Postby Lyric » Mon Mar 13, 2017 8:14 pm

I have just been back twice in four weeks, for funerals regrettably. What I have seen in those eight days make me determined, I will die in Spain.
I think the Brexit quitters are way premature.

BENIDORM
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 3542
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:15 pm
Location: Granada Province

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?

Postby BENIDORM » Mon Mar 13, 2017 8:30 pm

Gerry,
I think that your cats would soon adapt and I doubt that you would be able to leave without them even if you tried , they would follow you to the ends of the earth, I suspect that they are pampered Putty Tats.... :)
Have you ever considered selling and moving into rented accommodation, that way you would have plenty of money and not many problems...certainly worth considering.... :think:

Lyric...My thoughts are the same...but some might say that you don't die in Spain....just go to a better place..... :lol:

Regards,
Gordon

truebrit
Resident
Posts: 432
Joined: Tue Jul 21, 2015 5:25 pm
Location: La Cala

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?

Postby truebrit » Mon Mar 13, 2017 8:55 pm

Im in England at the moment, staying with my family in the East End of London and my OH and I are having a ball! We have done the markets, eaten Hot salt beef bagels. Gone to English, Japanese, Chinese, fusion. Also, good old English pubs(very much in decline). Seen both families and friends. Bought loads of unattainable products to take home. All this aside I am really looking forward to touching down at Malaga Airport once again and that is after 18 years there. Would I stay, God Willing....Yes! I would also say that, following my husbands heart attack 8 years ago we sold our car and use public transport. Also having lived in the Campo, moved to the town and couldnt be happier.

User avatar
Wicksey
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 2822
Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2004 1:21 pm
Location: Axarquia coast

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?

Postby Wicksey » Mon Mar 13, 2017 9:06 pm

I agree with everything you have all said.

I know of a number of people trying to move from the campo to the coast where there are buses and shops close by. I can't imagine why people living here talk going back to the UK rather than just move closer to facilities, as Benidorm mentioned, unless they are unhappy here for some reason.

We have no family apart from the in-laws in the UK and I feel no draw to ever go back. I haven't lived there for 17 years and it all seems so busy all the time there. I hate the Sunday shopping frenzy and the fact you never seem to get a quiet 'off peak' time anymore there. I do find things expensive there (especially the real ale which I love) and couldn't afford to have the same lifestyle we have here on our income. The short, dark winter days are something we moved here to avoid, and even in the middle of winter the blue skies are so bright. I would like to be able to escape July and August here but the cats prevent us from doing that anyway at the moment.

Free at Last
Resident
Posts: 1489
Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2006 1:32 pm
Location: Velez-Malaga

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?

Postby Free at Last » Tue Mar 14, 2017 11:00 am

We have no wish to return to live in the UK either, and certainly don't think we'd be better off financially if we had to.

The decision as to whether to move house in Spain or move into rented accommodation is a difficult one. If you sell up and buy another property in Spain you have to pay the high costs involved in commissions, legal fees and taxes. However, unless you can afford to pay rent out of your annual income (and if you start paying rent out of your income your general standard of living must surely go down) then you run the risk of having to use some of the capital from the sale of your property to pay the rent (which could get serious depending on how long you live), and the additional risk of one half of a couple dying and the survivor having to pay rent out of a reduced income. It would have been easier in the days when interest rates were much higher and investing the proceeds of a house sale could have generated enough to cover the rent. On balance we prefer the security of having a roof over our heads which is bought and paid for. Friends who rent seem to move about an awful lot due to having various problems with landlords (like them being reluctant to fix things which go wrong) and I would not like facing the prospect of moving every year or two.

anyroads
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 2044
Joined: Tue Apr 04, 2006 8:53 pm
Location: Hampshire, UK, Lebrija

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?

Postby anyroads » Tue Mar 14, 2017 11:54 am

BENIDORM,

There are no "experts" as far as the exchange rate is concerned.

I bought euros at "ICE" Waterloo at 1.1350 last Saturday.

It suits the UK the exchange rate being poor.

It is not too long ago since I got 1.40.

I don't think things have improved much in Europe ( certainly not in Spain ) and got that much worse in the UK in the meantime.
.
Things will come to a head. They can't keep kicking the can down the road as far as Greece is concerned and Italy is a basket case.

In my humble opinion the £ is greatly undervalued against the EURO.

anyroads.

BENIDORM
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 3542
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:15 pm
Location: Granada Province

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?.Remain in Spain!!!

Postby BENIDORM » Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:49 pm

Well I'm glad to see that many of the members have the same ideas as us ..Quite Reassuring !

And good thoughts about the idea of renting, I also prefer the 'own roof over head 'theory.. :thumbup:

Anyroads....Well I was hoping that you may have some insider information .. :lol:

As for improvement in Spain, well I can confirm that in the village/town where I reside there has been numerous new properties built during the past 6 months and some unfinished properties are now being completed, and generally most people seem to be prospering.
Also prices of food are very realistic and plenty of good local produced fruit and veg available at cheap prices.
Even our electric bill has gone down last year and things like car repairs / servicing are much cheaper now, more competition I suppose.
And the cost of a good cup of coffee with a biscuit or cake is locally 1 euro-1.10 in the local city.
And still Mega free tapas with drink still around 1.50 e here in Granada Province....
Regards,
Gordon

Free at Last
Resident
Posts: 1489
Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2006 1:32 pm
Location: Velez-Malaga

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?.Remain in Spain!!!

Postby Free at Last » Tue Mar 14, 2017 3:43 pm

I can think of some improvements in Spain, too. Unemployment was down to 18.63% by the end of last year, still far too high but far better than it was and moving in the right direction. Spanish GDP grew by 3.2% for two consecutive years in 2015 and 2016. The Spanish national minimum wage was increased by 8% from the start of this year, and income tax rates have been reduced too, with the starting rate now reduced to 19%. In Andalucia there has been a welcome change to inheritance tax, with a spouse or child now able to inherit a famiy home valued at up to €275,000 without liability to IHT, and it only has to be retained for 3 years before it can be sold instead of 10 years. Internet speeds and availability have improved enormously over what was available up to about 3 years ago, with 300mb fibre optic broadband now available in many areas (not the campo, obviously). We have some unfinished buildings now being worked on too, and sites which have stood empty since the crisis now being developed. The increased competition thing is true, the cost of my annual health club membership went down from €528 to €298 last year, which was a very welcome surprise, and I'm sure that was because there are now more of them around trying to attract new members.

BENIDORM
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 3542
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:15 pm
Location: Granada Province

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?.Remain in Spain!!!

Postby BENIDORM » Fri Mar 17, 2017 9:29 am

Free at last,
Interesting facts and figures, and good to see the upwards trend, and Yes Spain has a long way to go with improvements,but I'm Happy.!!

Amazing really how many people arrive in Spain claiming that they want a relaxed lifestyle and want to leave the 'rat-race' behind and feel calm and laid-back when in Spain....Then a few years down the line some are leaving stating that they can't live in Spain any longer due to the frustration and slowness of dealing with life's minor problems like paying an electric bill or arranging insurance etc..And of course dealing with 'functionarios' in the town hall and the tax office etc....but from my experience the same breed of humans are used for these mundane jobs globally ?

Anyway I'm just happy that my eyes opened this morning and my legs and arms are still working and I needed a cup of tea..... :lol:

Regards,
Gordon..the Contented OAP...

Free at Last
Resident
Posts: 1489
Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2006 1:32 pm
Location: Velez-Malaga

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?.Remain in Spain!!!

Postby Free at Last » Fri Mar 17, 2017 10:20 am

Well, Benidorm, I think it's undeniably true that bureacracy in Spain is much more difficult to deal with, mainly because of the unpredictability of never knowing exactly how the rules are going to be interpreted on a given day from place to place. I also find banks generally much worse to deal with, with higher charges and poor service in branches (although with online banking, direct debits and ATM machines, thankfully the occasions when I have to visit a branch are few).

However, I weigh those in the balance against things like being able to make medical appointments online and usually being able get a same day appointment (unlike having to ring the surgery when it opens, not be able to get through and eventually when I do get through being told that all the appointments for that day have gone and I should try again tomorrow - as was my most recent experience of trying to make an appointment for an elderly relative in the UK), and the excellent service from local businesses who will deliver things within 24 hours, at no charge, take away old appliances, again with no charge, etc.

If people find the balance in their own particular case comes down too heavily on the negative side, then they are doing the right thing by leaving instead of sticking around and being miserable.

BENIDORM
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 3542
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:15 pm
Location: Granada Province

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?.Remain in Spain!!!

Postby BENIDORM » Fri Mar 17, 2017 11:08 am

Free at Last,
I do agree with everything that you have stated, and I've always said that if someone is unhappy and have tried to overcome their difficulties and can't then yes it probably is a good idea to 'move on'.
However I do think that often there are many other issues involved and some people use the 'frustration' clause as an excuse for leaving when in reality they really don't need an excuse, if unhappy it's time to go ..
Maybe it's that I've been in Spain so long that I now just accept the slower pace of life and go along with it, but believe me I've experienced just about everything that could be thrown at me whilst living in Spain, and sometimes I've 'fallen out of Love with Spain', but got over it.
I do make allowances for people who come to live in Spain , but not to work, they have much more time on their hands and sometimes I think that probably is the problem, small problems become big problems and can take over some peoples lives.
I always urge everyone to talk about their problems with relatives/friends, often they can be resolved quickly, and of course forums like A.Com do actually provide this service, where people can remain anonymous and can ask for advice and in most cases another member will come along quickly with a solution.
Anyway..Don't Worry Be Happy .. :wave:
Regards,
Gordon.

elusive
Resident
Posts: 1007
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 11:49 am
Location: frigiliana

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?.Remain in Spain!!!

Postby elusive » Fri Mar 17, 2017 5:38 pm

Alot comes down to your own personality i guess. If you are laid back and things dont bother you so much then you are ok. But if you like things been done properly and quickly with people who know what they are doing then yes its a struggle.i went into our bank to ask them if they could send me another statement from my savings account as the monthly one hadnt arrived and i needed it for proof of address. Sat there for half hour and x amount of phonecalls. Sorry no can do. They can only send one out a month as its not from them it comes from the savings/insurance people.nothing to do with us even though its their account tried the other branch err maybe they can send one. Come back in two days and i will see whats sent to us. Go back and its just a basic print off that they could have done themselves (no use to me) driving me mad was an understatement. Guess what the lost statement turned up in the post a day later. Didnt know whether to laugh or cry!!! While im here also the fact it takes a month for a letter from the uk to arrive and when we get post so does the rest of the street as it seems the post lady only bothers to deliever once a week if that (normally a big stack of letters ) that have probable been sat in the post office for a week or two waiting for there to be enough letters to make her time worth while driving all of two mins from the post office. So one day i thought right ill go upto the post office after the van has left and see if theres any sitting there.nope nothing yet an hour later here she comes in the street with a bundle of letters! :crazy:

Having to track things down in shops instead of getting everything you need in wilko! If only they would open here!! Also been retired is obviously different than being of working age. seeing how business people work. Putting up with cash in hand illegal contracts ,if any at all. Everyone being on the fiddle is very frustrating for those with a moral compass

I guess if the negatives start becoming more than the positives then its time to maybe have a trip back home to see how you feel after a week under the cloud and rain! But its certainly better to have tried it then to have sat in the uk wondering what if years down the line

BENIDORM
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 3542
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:15 pm
Location: Granada Province

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?.Remain in Spain!!!

Postby BENIDORM » Sat Mar 18, 2017 9:11 am

Elusive,
I would say that you are correct about your guess regarding personality and circumstances affecting how a person 'deals' with the problems of trying to conduct any form of business in a very different culture.
Now I do try to have a very 'laid back approach' to tackling life's problems and I also try to maintain a good sense of humour....very important.!
However underneath I'm actually a very serious person, I may laugh at adversity,but I 'Don't suffer Fools' and I'm most certainly not a 'Doormat', and I do try to tackle all problems with stealth and meticulous planning.
Everyone makes fun of public/civil servants, but they reciprocate by joking about the general public and it's very important to remember that they actually have a very difficult job trying to balance pleasing their bosses and the public at the same time, they are the 'messengers' ..so don't shoot them. :wink:

I have worked and lived in Spain for long enough to realise that there is a correct way to deal with all matters and again it is important to note that.
I've probably made more mistakes than most, but I have tried hard to learn from my mistakes and I don't repeat them and I've always tried to help others by relating to how I've eventually overcome the problems.

So may I suggest that before anyone does anything in Spain that they just dip their toe in first and Don't jump in with both feet.!

It is not that difficult to arrange online banking/payment of utilities etc., and I would recommend everyone does that quickly when arriving in Spain, last year I only visited my bank twice , once because the Atm was out of order and the other as a courtesy visit to chat with my bank manager and get a free calendar.!
I'm lucky that I have a good business relationship with the manager and he telephones or e-mails me if he feels there is something that should be brought to my attention, and if I do attend the bank for some reason I always get swift attention, because they know that I wouldn't waste their time over trivialities.
So my advice is always keep calm and be quite clear about what you need to do and ask for advice here if required, if it's a personal matter there are many members who you could send a private message to and they would help you without any fear of making you feel stupid, everyone is always learning !!
And now may I wish everyone a very pleasant and carefree weekend, the sun has got his hat on today so I'm about to go out for a stroll and a coffee. :wave:
Regards,
Gordon

User avatar
Wicksey
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 2822
Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2004 1:21 pm
Location: Axarquia coast

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?.Remain in Spain!!!

Postby Wicksey » Sat Mar 18, 2017 11:54 am

elusive wrote:Having to track things down in shops instead of getting everything you need in wilko! If only they would open here!!


I find some of the Chinese shops here are pretty good. Before they arrived it was difficult to find odd things and we used to go from ferreteria to ferreteria trying to particular items. There's a huge one in Torre del Mar (the old Sumobel furniture shop, near to Dia and Mercadona). Quite a lot of their goods aren't made in China .... glass 'Pyrex' style cooking dishes are made in France for example, and I bought a nice piece of tablecloth off the reel that is better quality than most I've seen here. I always come out with more things than I really need :eh:

From memory, I didn't always find it so straightforward when I lived in the UK dealing with utlities etc, and we haven't really experienced great problems here. With both of us being ex-civil servants, from what we hear from old colleagues still working in those departments, it sounds horrendous now and I am so glad we escaped when we did. They seem to have plans to shut all the offices I worked in in East Anglia and so there will be no local person anyone can go to for face to face advice, just one of those dreaded phone so-called helplines.

BENIDORM
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 3542
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:15 pm
Location: Granada Province

Re: Stay in SPAIN or RETURN to Un-United Kingdom ?.Remain in Spain!!!

Postby BENIDORM » Sat Mar 18, 2017 3:34 pm

Elusive made an observation..
''Having to track things down in shops instead of getting everything you need in wilko! If only they would open here!! ''

OK I have Good News for you, there are Wilko shops here in Spain, but they are called Wongos... :lol:

I am of course referring to the 100's of Chinese Bazaar shops and as Wicksey rightly points out they are pretty good, they do stock some tat but in general you can locate most 'useful' items there.
Many times I've heard people say that they are all the same ....selling the same ..same old, but actually that's not true, I started using Chinese wholesalers here in Spain over 20 years ago, we had 2 ' Todo' shops as well as our clothing shops and we found some fantastic lines and very cheap.
The owner of one of the wholesalers explained to me that much of the stock would be different at each warehouse because the owners came from many different parts of China and tended to buy from their local provinces..so there you go !..Good selection and many good quality items.
And same as Wicksey we always buy more things than we need and I have several boxes of 'useful' items stored downstairs in my bunker, probably will never use them !!
As far as buying things we miss from UK, well to be honest there is very little that we can't find here or at least a good substitute..

Regards,
Gordon.
Last edited by BENIDORM on Sat Mar 18, 2017 8:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.


Return to “Living in Andalucia”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests