catalan

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flyeogh
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Re: catalan

Postby flyeogh » Fri Jul 20, 2018 4:03 pm

wollie wrote:I just wonder if anyone can give an update on this topic.
I do know the extradition has being lifted, however i do not know what this means...

Many thanks....
Sorry Wollie didn't answer your question. It means the exiled politicians will not be returned to Spain from the countries they are currently in.

Spain could reapply at a future date but I suspect they will reside in countries who clearly dissagree with Spain (not hard to find) and thus the result of any future extradition case is likely to remain the same.

As I said I think this may be positive. At the end of the day locking people up will solve nothing.

HTH
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maureenscot
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Re: catalan

Postby maureenscot » Fri Jul 20, 2018 6:34 pm

It also means that should they return, they could be arrested. It is only the request for extradition that has been stood down. Also any future gov could decide to reinstate the request for extradition. These people who were not violent could have been facing being in prison until they die given their ages. i am for united Spain but not for treating citizen's like this. No mention of the hundreds of police sent to violently recover the ballot boxes. No mention of the folk who have been in prison without charge all this time. Other countries have been looking aghast at Rajoy's reaction. He did not need to take such a hard stand. Better to decide through the legitimate ballots than go back to the past. No doubt the separation issue would have been put to bed and unification would have prevailed.

and Rajoy's party is in no position to take moral high grounds in any case. wonder if any of these guys will go to jail

wollie
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Re: catalan

Postby wollie » Fri Jul 20, 2018 6:55 pm

Thanks for updates.
Sid, thanks for the interesting article. Seems to me everyone wants this to go away ASAP which is really the only workable solution.
To me Peudomont?? is totally discredited as he did a runner, the Germans courts said this, the Spanish courts said this so for all intents and purposed if he returns and is charged it escalates the situation.
Then if he is not charged all the others will walk and the Catalan thing can be addressed in some meaningful manner.

flyeogh,
I not sure what you mean by Spain and the 21st century.
I look at the news and see me and my wealthy friends having a great life, we buy all our food in Tesco and if it closes we will starve in a Month.
I then go to poorer Spain and i see it as very sustainable in producing food for its people so i wonder what wealth is.
I have to add i just an outside observer but i am interested in whats going on... sorry for rambling on...

They say "money isn't everything its the only thing"

flyeogh
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Re: catalan

Postby flyeogh » Sat Jul 21, 2018 6:13 am

wollie wrote:I not sure what you mean by Spain and the 21st century.
By 21st century I could look at several aspects but perhaps the biggest is accountability. We are at last in Spain seeing people across the board being brought to justice. However, that justice results in different outcomes depending on who you are and not the crime you committed. It also may be just the tip of the iceberg.

On a broader front I think Sanchez in the last 2 months has taken three major steps towards what I’d expect from a 21st century country:

The movement of ETA and Catalan prisoners to locations where they can have family visits shows great empathy. Even ETA killers will one day be returned to society and that I think is more likely to be successful when, where relevant, empathy is shown.

The understanding that economy is the movement of money and not the accumulation of money. And a willingness to act upon this.

The understanding that abuse of women's rights and domestic violence are often related to poverty.

wollie wrote:I look at the news and see me and my wealthy friends having a great life, we buy all our food in Tesco and if it closes we will starve in a Month. I then go to poorer Spain and i see it as very sustainable in producing food for its people so i wonder what wealth is.
My Madrid based spanish family can't afford to shop in Tescos. They choose cheaper supermarkets. But if those supermarkets closed they'd equally starve. But worse for them they couldn't jump on a plane and move to somewhere life is better.

As for sustainability I have serious concerns there. With the changing climate, and investment likely to be harder in the future, I can see Spain’s food imports increasing at a much faster rate.
wollie wrote:I have to add i just an outside observer but i am interested in what’s going on.. sorry for rambling on...
Some may consider it trivial but at a different level I registered my marriage (took place out of Spain) to a spaniard. I hired a spanish lawyer to assist. After 17 months the process is only now being completed. Many of the interactions at the town hall and government offices where hand written in books. It is just one example of many inconveniences Spanish people accept. And that includes Spanish businesses.

Don’t get me wrong; as I said above I’m somewhat optimistic for Spain, but am also realistic.

Of course, there are many other countries struggling with these problems but it does seem that Spain, after years of neglect, is having to fight on many fronts at the same time. If it was just the poverty and unemployment, just division in society, just corruption, ……..
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wollie
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Re: catalan

Postby wollie » Sat Jul 21, 2018 5:26 pm

flyeogh,
Thanks for informed reply.

Best regards...


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