Purchasing Property

[Loopy Lisa]

The place we had hoped to buy was much more remote about 30 minutes over the hills to huercsl overa and 15 minutes to the closest area of civilisation where bread and milk can be bought!
We are now reviewing the level of remoteness as we fell in live with the house and convinced ourselves that it would be fine

[Pamela1]

Lisa, i'm sure you will find another property that you will love and one that isn't so far out...

[maureenscot]

Lisa keep us posted. Good luck

[peteroldracer]

I cannot understand how any person, couple or family can isolate themselves from human contact. Do they really despise the rest of the human race so much, or is it that they are generally disliked? Shades of "The Shining"....lol

[Ursula]

Hi Lisa,

I am really happy for you, this is an exciting time. When purchasing a property in Spain, it sounds great when you are far from anybody, high up in the mountains with great views and the nearest neighbour is half an hour away. But, I have seen a lot of couples retire to Spain and fall into difficulties. Please consider a few things when retiring to Spain.

Your age - a lot of people want the dream, living in the sunshine, no worries, peace and quiet. None of us are getting any younger, if one of you should fall ill, how quickly could an ambulance reach your house, and how easy would it be for an ambulance to access? If it is high up in the hills in the middle of nowhere, how could they easily locate your property? If you cannot run to a next door neighbour for help...

Would you really want to be so remote and only live off grid? Sometimes, it is nice to walk to the nearest bar and have a beer and tapas and a chat with some neighbours or friends without getting into a car. Sometimes, you fancy a take-away, or a meal out, but in remote places this means getting into your car and driving half an hour or more there and back. In towns you can have your take-away delivered (not us, I will add, we live in a village and have to drive which is why I am commenting).

I know couples who have gone back to the UK because one of their partners has fallen ill and had to go to and fro to the hospital and the cost of the translator (and fuel) and not understanding fully what the doctors /specialists said was frustrating for them. The majority of the time you can go to your local doctor / hospital. Sometimes you have to go to a specialist hospital in Malaga (cancer treatment).

Some of these campo houses are registered as one plot of land and the owner has sold off plots over the years, I know one family who had problems with water because their next door neighbour (Spanish) suddenly decided that they were not allowed to share the well. It is much better to have your own direct supply of water, electricity and/or gas if applicable (where I live we still buy gas bottles).

Public transport? There will come a time when we are too old to drive. Shopping, going to the dentist, going out for the day, visiting friends, a day at the beach or a walk on the promenade. The cost of running a car.

Just a few things to think about before you commit. I do not intend to burst anybody´s bubble, just speaking from experience.

All the best to you wherever you decide to live.

BEst wishes
Ursula

[peteroldracer]

Ursula, very well put!

[Wicksey]

Los Velez is very cold in winter

Your not wrong there .......... it is warmed in grey light but it is about 6 degrees warmer here than Velez Rubio where they have snow

We've had snow here too Lisa near the coast, and the beaches of Alicante are covered in the stuff!

I cannot understand how any person, couple or family can isolate themselves from human contact. Do they really despise the rest of the human race so much, or is it that they are generally disliked? Shades of "The Shining"....lol

Some of us just like the peace and quiet Peter. For the past 35 years we have always lived in quiet villages or out in the campo. I don't want to hear a lot of traffic and other people's day to day noise. We get occasional cars passing throughout the day (and sometimes horse riders or mountain-bikers) and see our farming neighbours to wave to, so are not completely isolated, and we are only 1.5kms from the pueblo so have the best of both worlds.

[Loopy Lisa]

Ursula. Thank you for your comments and for taking the time to put them down for me. I am 51 and my partner is 57 and we intend to give up the rat race, cash in on our UK home which was purchased 20 years ago and being so close to London has substantially increased in value. We intend to spend some on the Spanish house, budget of Euro 300K for a property that has the "wow" factor.

At the moment, we have to drive or get a cab more or less wherever we go if we want to have a drink and that isn't an issue for us (he drives there and I drive back ).

Living off grid is as the house is now, they had a quote to connect for Euro 20K and we thought that this was work we would like to have carried out.

As we are comparatively young, (for retirees) we thought we would live in the wilderness for 10-15 years and then move onto a small urbanisation or the edge of a village where there was a community with shared gardens etc in order to escape the maintenance. This would also fit in with the fact that as we get older, we will want to be closer to facilities. Also we are bringing our rabbit and guinea pig with us from the UK and there are vets in both Velez Rubio and Heurcal Overa with English Speaking staff, I didn't investigate a doctor for us!!!

For us privacy is really important and a tranquil lifestyle. I would really like a view so we can see changes in the local area through the year, a large pool 10X5 would be perfect (as I have skeletal issues which mean I cannot do regular exercise such as running any more), 3 beds + annex or 4 beds.

And finally YES, the right property is out there - just waiting for me to go and view it!!

I cannot understand how any person, couple or family can isolate themselves from human contact. Do they really despise the rest of the human race so much, or is it that they are generally disliked? Shades of "The Shining"....lol

The reason for being remote or away from the hubbub of life is merely that we don't want to be disturbed by kids, traffic, barking dogs etc. As well as if we want to argue and swear at each other, we can do so without an audience ......... although it is more a case of if we make noise - music by the pool etc we are unlikely to cause a nuisance to our neighbours. I don't want to be overlooked and I am keen to maintain our privacy. I think we are now looking for a happy medium, this obviously means that we have many more properties that we can look at.

[Enrique]

Hi L L,
Just a few pointers for the " tranquil lifestyle"............if you're located in Olive country.......buzz of tree shakers during harvest time November to March.......chain saws during pruning time April- May, then there is the whine from the Sprayers as the olive trees get their Meds .

Spanish weekend/ olive equipment Casas will all have dogs chained up 24/7............and some have been know to bark 24/7 too.........

Coming from London where a shed could set you back £1m..............300k will buy you half a province up this way so go easy on what you offer.... ..

Will say its nice staying out here from time to time...................

[Pamela1]

Some of us just like the peace and quiet Peter. We get occasional cars passing throughout the day (and sometimes horse riders or mountain-bikers) and see our farming neighbours to wave to, so are not completely isolated, and we are only 1.5kms from the pueblo so have the best of both worlds.

You described it very well Wicksey...The best of both worlds" Your place sounds alot like mine..1.5 miles from the nearest village is great for us...We have four farms within sight of our house and a few cave houses in the hill sides,we know all the owners, Each of them always pop in when we are there and have a beer on the patio and enjoy a good chin wag...The farmers tell us to go and help ourselves to peaches and all they have planted and we reciiprocate with grapes, olives and the many plants my brother in law grows on our land..In the village there is everything we need and we have got to know many people,we go out to the local bars and mix with the locals, no need to cook dinner as we are all full from the huge portions of free tapas...

There is also a large busy town within 4miles that has everything anyone could possibly need, to be honest there is more on my Spanish door step than where we live in the Uk..

I do love the laid back lifestyle and i have to say after a morning in the town im ready to get back to the peace and quiet of our house...My children and grandchildren love it too, they enjoy the freedom of having so much space and doing what they wish..

I think everyone has their own preference of where they would like to be situated and what is good for some is bad for others, each to their own..

[suzyq]

Seriously do not underestimate the problem of barking dogs. No matter how remote there will be chained up dogs - with goat's , hunting dogs deliberately kept hungry or just guard dogs. They bark incessantly and the noise travels for miles.

[elusive]

Yeah its amazing how the dogs barking echos all over the place. We over look the frigiliana campo and the barking maybe coming from over the hills but you can hear it as if its just below you.alot of the time the campo is anything but quiet

[Lyric]

Frigiliana is noisy though, our apartment was at the other end of the village from you and when we were back there cleaning it we nearly always commented on how noisy it was, donkeys, goats, dogs, cockerels it has the lot !
Much quieter in our bit of Campo. Still get the Raza Hotel feeding time though and it's miles away.

[Miro]

Google "noisiest countries in the world and you'll find this: "Spain is the second noisiest country in the world after Japan, and Madrid is one of the noisiest capitals. Up to nine million in the Spanish population are exposed to levels of noise that exceed the tolerance limit of 65 dB set by WHO."

Make no mistake, Lisa: Spain is noisy as hell. I used to live bang in the centre of Palma, and remember going to an agroturismo hotel one weekend out in the "campo" for a bit of R&R. I was glad to get back to the peace and quiet of the city on Monday morning! And like it or not, there are a good few expats here who regard certain aspects of Spain as backward - "third world", if you like, as seen from the perspective of someone who has spent most of their lives in, say, Britain. I was in a busy cafe in Málaga the other day, & was appalled as I always am at the filth & litter strewn under the bar from all the days' previous customers; shortly afterwards I went to IKEA, and for a short while I fantasized that I was in a modern, efficient country where everything works as you expect it to, down to the natty little conveyor belt to take away the used trays in the restaurant.

Moving to and living in Spain can be a wonderful "experience" and there are many positives I could mention - but it's an utterly different experience from "visiting" & enjoying the "quaintness"; if you want peace & tranquility and are looking for a stress free (& bureaucracy free) life, perhaps you should be considering a cottage in Wales or somewhere!

[Wicksey]

There are dogs in cages that can bark all night long but they are on the opposite hillside to us and our bedroom so we don't hear them so much. In the winter there's no problem as the windows are shut. That's why I said earlier about looking out for innocuous-looking sheds that turn out to be dog corrals when you are looking at houses to buy. Equally, you don't want a load of houses that are rented out in the summer nearby .... we have experienced that too which I think is possibly worse than the barking dogs!

Our neighbours are farming veg in greenhouses and are generally pretty quiet. The olives around here are very small scale and a few families come up and collect them, but nowadays they are being replaced by mangoes. That's why renting in an area is very useful to get an idea what is going on.

One of the noisiest country houses we lived in was in France where they irrigated all summer long from the river. They used an ancient old tractor engine that, although about 400m away, sounded like it was under our bedroom window all night long and was a horrendous noise.

[Loopy Lisa]

I am taking all your comments on board and they are certainly, giving us real food for thought. We are certain that we do not want to live on a modern urbanisation/development with communal areas. That much is certain.

This is the holiday villa we had which cemented in our mind the thought that we wished to move and make a new permanent home in Spain.
https://www.kyero.com/en/property/38468 ... sarabonela

To show you what we have in our shortlisted properties I give you
The doer upper that is cheap. Lots to check here, like what is the rest of that open area going to become?
https://www.kyero.com/en/property/38206 ... le-taberno
And one that seems to have it all except views and is top of our budget
https://www.kyero.com/en/property/38649 ... -sale-coin
Maybe abit too close to neighbours
https://www.kyero.com/en/property/35913 ... os-del-rio
And this one.
https://www.kyero.com/en/property/26599 ... -antequera

But in total we have around 80 properties shortlisted, but none seem quite perfect (well not until I win the lottery!!)
The right house is there and it is waiting for us to find it!!!

[Miro]

It seems you haven't even decided what area of Spain you want to be in yet, so naturally your "short" list is going to be rather long! Makes it even harder to understand why you persisted so long with one particular property that clearly had serious issues, but never mind. I had a quick look at your selection (I bet the owners will be watching the stats and getting excited that the number of hits has suddenly increased significantly!) and for me the holiday rental you had in Casarabonela looks easily the nicest. I wonder why you didn't go for that in the first place? I can't profess to know Murcia at all, but much of it seems pretty desolate and for me Málaga province has to be a better bet. Casarabonela is quite nice, and only 20-30 minutes drive from Málaga city / airport / civilization (relative!) etc. etc.

[peteroldracer]

We have just started the purchase of a house in Murcia, having sold our home. We have lived for the past 12 years in a small hamlet, part of Comares area, in a new villa with pool and as another thread tells we want to not have to get in the car every time we want anything. Campo living has its good and bad sides, where up until very recently (well after we decided to move) good neighbours, lovely views across a river valley and peace and quiet, apart from the dogs that bark for no reason and the dogs that bark because you or someone has dared to pass within 20 metres of their boundary, the almost daily chainsawing by the neighbour across the road and the local peacock!
Now the change: a few months ago the elder son of the neighbour across bought a moto - one with the loudest exhaust I have ever heard (and this from an ex-motorcycle racer). He then decided that he would garage this in an empty unfinished house just behind ours, and since we have been subjected to the up-and-over door being raised or lowered and the scream of the bike, several times a day as he whizzes within a metre of our windows and starting at 6 am when he goes off olive-picking or what ever. He was asked to move it away or generally stop annoying us but became even more stroppy. The last straw was when we had what turned out to be the purchasers of our house here, who had parked their car on the access road to ours and the two neighbouring houses. We came out to find he or his father had parked the moto across the back of our visitors' rental car, despite there being lots of room for it to be ridden past into the garage. I asked the father, who was pacing up and down in the evening gloom in his dressing gown and slippers to get the moto moved, at which he went loco, shouting, waving his arms and carrying on! Wanting the prospective buyers to not see more of this (I had just told them as we walked out that all the neighbours were nice people...!) I moved the thing out of the way, leaning it carefully against a wall, and the buyers left, apologising profusely for parking there. The rant went on and on, with the son coming out to join in, and I was glad I did not know quite what was being spluttered at high volume in broad Andaluz! We have not spoken since, and fortunately it did not affect the sale.
It does support any argument that you are better off well away from people, who can obviously pretend to be friends whilst harbouring grudges for whatever reason. In my experience the campo Spanish have no manners as we understand them, and no concept of considering others before their own desires. The son is that awful combination of ignorance and arrogance - if I was doing something that could be changed that was annoying anyone I would stop it, not continue or escalate the behaviour, but that is not their way. I understand why the father felt he should support his son, but am sad he chose to do so. Notably his wife and other son are still outwardly chatty and friendly.
The whole saga nearly made us revise our plans to buy in Murcia and rent instead, where at least it is possible to walk away if the home becomes spoilt by anything, but we have gone ahead with the deposit and thus the purchase.
For all the handshaking and cheek-kissing that goes on between Spanish, they really can be self-centred folk, ready to bear grudges and do what they want. It has shown us why there are several sets of people within a small hamlet that never seem to speak to each other for reasons not discoverable by guiris!

[Pamela1]

Peter, good honest post!! In my experience of the ones who are self centred and think they can do what they want are also very negative towards anything other people do and they are quick to point out what you can and cannot do...Yes there are those who hold grudges and it's quite often over nothing...

[Miro]

I would really like a view so we can see changes in the local area through the year

Just another thought: again, I admit I do not know Murcia or the area you were looking in, but isn't it mostly desert? Does it ever change?! One thing I sometimes do feel I miss even here is seeing four seasons.

Interesting point raised by Peter & Pamela. For 12 years we've lived in a small (urban) community where all the owners have pretty much got on well with each other, but in recent years one (Spanish) couple have lost the plot and turned on everyone & the community over something so trivial it doesn't even warrant explaining. It's utterly bizarre, because they're elderly and now isolated in their own community - the rest of us basically couldn't care less (except that they're trying to disrupt everything the community tries to do - but being outnumbered it's only an irritation & inconvenience) - but for them the atmosphere must be rather unpleasant - nobody even talks to them anymore, because they're waging a private vendetta against everyone else. Since we still get on well with all the other neighbours, as I said, it doesn't matter to us. But, if they were our only neighbours for miles around....