UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Information and questions about the Law in Spain and Andalucia.
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby JAWG » Fri Sep 04, 2009 9:22 pm

And what would you do, Stu, if you witnessed a bank robbery? Take your business to another bank.
I'm with POR on this.
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Mowser
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Mowser » Fri Sep 04, 2009 9:40 pm

Iordan & Stu

I think you're getting the wrong end of the stick here. If a car isn't legal and it crashes into you what then? Would your insurance pay out? Would you lose your no-claims? What if you were seriously injured and there was no insurance? Report the free-loading sods.
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby El Cid » Fri Sep 04, 2009 10:19 pm

I think you will find that if a car is illegal but insured, that all third party claims have to be paid - but the insured's losses will not be paid.

You also need to understand that in Spain, many risks are not covered by insurance - earthquakes and floods for example. These are covered by the "Consorcio" which is a central fund set up to cover uninsured losses. Each premium that you pay on motor or other policies has a significant percentage paid into this fund.

It also covers losses caused by uninsured drivers - of which there are thousands - and they are not all Brits in "illegal" UK reg cars.

In no way am I condoning "illegal" or uninsured UK cars in Spain but you do need to understand that the situation regarding uninsured losses is very different from the UK.

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby peteroldracer » Fri Sep 04, 2009 11:05 pm

No doubt you are right Sid - but one must also take into account that a person who cheerfully drives around in an untaxed car, is also highly likely to also drive around in an un-tested, unserviced, uninsured vehicle, ignoe speed limits and traffic rules, drive whilst drunk or drugged....it is an attitude thing, and in my experience one is either an upright citizen, or irresponsible scum.
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby julian » Sat Sep 05, 2009 12:53 am

"that a person who cheerfully drives around in an untaxed car, is also highly likely to also drive around in an un-tested, unserviced, uninsured vehicle, ignoe speed limits and traffic rules, drive whilst drunk or drugged"
you forgot to mention that he is also probably a child molester and serial killer as well..what imagination!

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby disco_stu » Sat Sep 05, 2009 8:34 am

peteroldracer wrote:No doubt you are right Sid - but one must also take into account that a person who cheerfully drives around in an untaxed car, is also highly likely to also drive around in an un-tested, unserviced, uninsured vehicle, ignoe speed limits and traffic rules, drive whilst drunk or drugged....it is an attitude thing, and in my experience one is either an upright citizen, or irresponsible scum.


Thats a pretty imaginative assumption. So are you grassing them because they are likely (in your opinion) to also drive around in an un-tested, unserviced, uninsured vehicle, ignore speed limits and traffic rules, drive whilst drunk or drugged....have a bad attitude, and in your experience is irresponsible scum? Or is it because you think you may be subsidising their beer drinking activities?
Or maybe you feel they should contribute more towards the UKs road building and infrastructure projects?
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby barry » Sat Sep 05, 2009 10:28 am

OR is POR doing it because it is wrong not to have road tax? It is wrong to drive illegally whether spanish,english or whatever.

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby disco_stu » Sat Sep 05, 2009 6:05 pm

barry wrote:OR is POR doing it because it is wrong not to have road tax? It is wrong to drive illegally whether spanish,english or whatever.

I don'y know, why not ask him yourself. I'm personaly interested to know if he grasses up natives as well as expats and if its just (alleged)road tax evasion or all kinds of lawbreaking. I wondering what other things he's taken pictures of. :wink:
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby julian » Sat Sep 05, 2009 6:30 pm

as POR has never driven through a 50km/h section at 57 km/h, nor driven through the lights when they are on amber, and of course always turns his mobile off when in a petrol station then he is perfectly entitled to take fotos and grass people up..it would be very different if he had ever broken the law himself, but of course that is not the case.

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby barry » Sat Sep 05, 2009 7:53 pm

Surely the point is that an untaxed uk car shows that it has quite likely to have been in the country for more than 6 months and therfore is not being legally driven.Full stop.

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby julian » Sat Sep 05, 2009 8:02 pm

correct.

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disco_stu
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby disco_stu » Sun Sep 06, 2009 7:52 am

Assuming again..The fact is a lot of expats transport cars, so its quite possible that the car has not been on the road in the UK.
Anyway, whatever who's right or wrong i feel safer knowing there are heroes out there armed with cameras ready to inform on those nasty, evil criminals who may (or may not) be evading uk tax whilst living in Spain.
I hope you get rewarded for your bravery soon.
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Campo Steve » Sun Sep 06, 2009 8:34 am

I'm not commening on the reporting of offenders here but must clear up one point. If it is a UK registered car (you tell by the number plate) then it is irrelevent whether or not it had been on the road in the UK. It needs a tax disc. Unless SORN'd. in which case it would need re-registering in Spain, so would have a Spanish plate

"May or may not be evading UK tax"...... If it is UK registered then it requires a valid UK tax disc. If it doesn't have one then it is tax evasion. No "may not" about it.
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Beachcomber » Sun Sep 06, 2009 11:09 am

disco_stu wrote:... i feel safer knowing there are heroes out there armed with cameras ready to inform on those nasty, evil criminals who may (or may not) be evading uk tax whilst living in Spain...

Probably not necessary. I understand from a friend in the guardia that people from DVLA are here in Spain doing that for themselves! He may be just spoofing but who knows?

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby peteroldracer » Sun Sep 06, 2009 11:15 am

The reaction of some people to my stance shows up a worrying and deeper scism. Does everyone think that there should be no rules for anybody, and that it is purely a question of the police on the one hand, and the people on the other?
Unless an anarchist or a criminal, surely everyone should accept that laws are essential for the civilised operation of society - to protect the moral and peaceful part of the population from the largely selfish and idle behaviour of the others. Punishments are necessary to try and enforce the laws that have been agreed democratically by the majority, whether these be financial sanctions or whatever, and the police and other authorities are there to ensure that these laws have indeed been broken, and need every bit of help they can get from the public to do this.
I would report anyone if I had evidence that they were a thief, a child molester, a wife-beater, a terrorist, or any other way that they are trying to act outside the law.
Ignoring wrongdoing of any kind, either because of some misplaced concept of it being wrong to inform, or simply saying "it's not my place" is exactly what happened in Germany in the 1930s, when the population ignored progressively more and more obscene and immoral acts, in that case being done by the state, that ultimately led to the death of millions. In today's society, at least in Western Europe, the scale of wrongdoing is nothing like at that level, but every time someone buys something down the pub that "fell of the back of a lorry" they are supporting burglaries and robberies, when they buy what they cheerfully downgrade as "dodgy" goods from the looky-looky men they are supporting people trafficking and organised crime....it goes on.
I just happen to think that we could all try a bit harder not to turn away.
I would, and have, accept punishments when I have infringed the rules (speeding, fined £20, 1972), and accept that we all have a choice as to whether to obey or not. If people are worried that they may get fined for driving around untaxed cars, they can always do what the majority of us do - pay up.
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Devils Advocate » Sun Sep 06, 2009 11:26 am

Peter, so many of your arguments have substance. It's the way you put that substance over that winds people up and makes them oppose you with a vengeance.
Property owner in Andalucia since 2002. How time flies.

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Bongtrees » Sun Sep 06, 2009 1:42 pm

Devils Advocate wrote:Peter, so many of your arguments have substance. It's the way you put that substance over that winds people up and makes them oppose you with a vengeance.



Only idiots would do that. :roll:
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Jool » Sun Sep 06, 2009 9:12 pm

when they buy what they cheerfully downgrade as "dodgy" goods from the looky-looky men they are supporting people trafficking and organised crime....it goes on.


Really? How do you know? What do you suggest we do? I cannot believe the local police do not know they are there on the beaches even though they pretend to be sun bathers etc.....no -one takes bags THAT large to the beach and they wander around openly.........

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby katy » Mon Sep 07, 2009 12:12 pm

http://www.diariosur.es/20090907/marbel ... 90907.html

Increase in the number of drivers without Insurance, mainly young people. Ok if they run into you cos they have spanish cars :roll:

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby blondie » Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:28 pm

I also had a Brit plated car over here, drowned in floods a few years ago. I only had Spanish ITV and insurance paid out, not MOT either. Just to add fuel to the fire! :D


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