UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Information and questions about the Law in Spain and Andalucia.
barry
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby barry » Tue Sep 08, 2009 2:33 pm

If the uk car has been in spain for over six months without leaving the country then according to european law it is illegal. Insurance may pay out but may see it as a loophole not to pay.The question is why are you prepared to take the risk?

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby ashtondav » Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:54 am

No it's not. A UK car is illegal if it has been DRIVEN in Spain for over six months in any calendar year.

As long as a UK car has a valid MOT, UK road tax and insurance it is legal in Spain for as long as it would be legal in the UK (ie one year, or until one of the three expires). BUT, it cannot be driven/used in Spain for more than six months in that year.

In other words. Get MOT, Road tax and insurance (including long term travel in europe) on Jan 01 and drive to Spain. Pop out to Spain for no more than six months in total in, say, February, June, August and September and December (when you drive back to UK in time for its next MOT etc) and you're legal.

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Campo Steve » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:16 am

How do you prove it hasn't been driven for six months? If you don't have ferry tickets to show you took it out of the country and the Guardia try to do you, you could have problems as you have no proof. Although you may be legal, proving it could be impossible. You could show you weren't here, but how do you prove noone else drove it?

Could be costly.
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby julian » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:26 am

"How do you prove it hasn't been driven for six months"

how can they prove it has?

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Campo Steve » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:30 am

Guess it ends up as your word against theirs. Wonder who the courts would believe.
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby julian » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:36 am

eeven in court they need proof, not just word

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Beachcomber » Thu Sep 10, 2009 9:53 am

It all seems a lot of trouble to go to just to be able to keep some clapped out old banger in Spain on UK plates. Most of the ones I have seen don't even look as though they would make it to the UK and back on an annual basis to get their tax and MOT. :shock:

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby katy » Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:15 am

Quite a few bentleys, Rolls etc. being driven on UK plates. Maybe they can't afford to go back to tax them :lol:

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby El Cid » Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:18 am

julian wrote:"How do you prove it hasn't been driven for six months"

how can they prove it has?


Strictly speaking it is the owner who is only allowed to be in Spain for 6 months rather than the car. It’s a question of residency. Forgetting the 90 day registration rule which really has little to do with residency, the only clearly defined residency rule is the one used for tax residency which is 6 months (not necessarily in one period) in one calendar year.

Once the owner has exceeded that stay he is legally tax resident and not allowed to drive a foreign plated car.

Quoting David Searle, if the owner came to Spain on a four month visit without a car and later that year returned with his car he could only use it for 2 months in that year.

Also, because the calendar year tax rule applies, it is possible to drive the car for just under 12 months continuously if you start the clock at the beginning of July and end it at the end of June the next year.

So, the onus is on the owner, not to prove how long the car has been in Spain but to prove how long HE has been in Spain, which is not quite so difficult.

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Campo Steve » Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:28 am

julian wrote:eeven in court they need proof, not just word


Does that stop you getting a ticket in the first place? You then have the hassle of appealing the ticket etc.

Another point is what happens if for whatever reason your trip out to take the car back for MOT has to be cancelled/delayed and you over run the vehicles stay in Spain. As soon as it is overseas for more than 12 months the UK treats it as permanently exported.

Far easier to keep an old Spanish car out here. Tax is a lot less as well and no hassle having to take the car back to UK for MOT.
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Beachcomber » Thu Sep 10, 2009 11:52 am

The Guardia know that very few foreigners have either the wherewithal or the inclination to contest a dodgy fine. That's why they pick on them to keep up their daily quota.

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby El Cid » Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:00 pm

As a Linea Directa policyholder, I have the "Gestion de multas" optional cover which means they do it all for me should I wish to contest a fine.

It's about €15 and with all these "dodgy" fines being given out it's a worthwhile option.

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby ashtondav » Thu Sep 10, 2009 4:45 pm

Far easier to keep an old Spanish car out here. Tax is a lot less as well and no hassle having to take the car back to UK for MOT.


Oh yes, easier but not cheaper. I've been quoted €1200 for a 15 year old banger. Insurance on that would be about €300, road tax about €80 and ITV €40. Add in a few repairs and we're talking €530 a year. Say the old banger lasts 5 years (guffaw, guffaw) thats about €200 a year for the capital cost. That makes at least €730 a year.

As it is I spend €1,100 a year on car hire (about 4 months worth). It will be much cheaper to bring my car over in march, have a leisurely drive down taking in sights at Burgos, keep it down there until December and drive back with a boot full of wine which will save me another £150.

Total cost of this option is €330 fuel, €120 ferries, €300 hotels (€750 total). Usually I don't bother with the toll roads. I save €300 on flights and parking (for the inbound and outbound journies), €165 on wine, €55 on car hire excess insurance. So the net cost of the drive down option is €530 a year.

I reckon i would have to be living in Spain for six months of the year before the 'buy a spanish banger' option became the cheapest way to do things.

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby julian » Thu Sep 10, 2009 4:50 pm

there are 15 year old bangers from around 500 euros here

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby ashtondav » Thu Sep 10, 2009 5:44 pm

Yeah, I've had a look at one or two in that price bracket. They wouldn't last a year.

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Campo Steve » Thu Sep 10, 2009 6:01 pm

I've seen £2000 cars in the UK that wouldn't make it down here and back.

I guess it comes down to what you want. Personally we preferred to get down here as quickly as possible (that's why we bought here) and couldn't be bothered sitting in a car for a couple of days. Three hours on a plane was enough. Enjoying ourselves here was more important to us than saving a couple of quid on a few bottles of wine. Also helped that we smoke and what we saved on fags paid for our flights for 4 years.

But if you are happy driving, fair enough.
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby julian » Thu Sep 10, 2009 6:17 pm

Also helped that we smoke and what we saved on fags ..now that´s what I call positive thinking...smoking saves money !!! :D I LOVE IT

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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Devils Advocate » Thu Sep 10, 2009 6:42 pm

I've seen £2000 cars in the UK that wouldn't make it down here and back.


Quite possibly but seriously speaking they are cubing cars now under the scrappage scheme which would drive around the world twice without a hitch.

In general now, if you are on a budget then 2k in England would get you a very presentable, not too old and reliable motor............that's why guys bring them across I'd imagine :idea: .
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby Miro » Thu Sep 10, 2009 7:01 pm

Devils Advocate wrote:seriously speaking they are cubing cars now under the scrappage scheme which would drive around the world twice without a hitch.


Yes, but think about how warm and fuzzy you'll feel, knowing that you're doing your bit to save the polar bears by taking an old gas guzzler off the road and replacing it with a hybrid that runs on nice, clean electricity - the vast majority of which is produced by burning fossil fuels. :shock: Will be interesting to see if there's a similar scrappage scheme in 10+ years time. I wonder how governments will propose scrapping the batteries in these environmentally friendly cars?
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Re: UK Road Tax, do we need it?

Postby tarotwoman » Thu Sep 10, 2009 7:07 pm

ashtondav,

What car are you looking at to quote those prices? My 12 year old Fiat Punto (British but now on Spanish matricula) costs about 250 euros insurance, 40 euros tax, and 34 itv. Bigger cars cost more.


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