Scary stuff

Information and questions about the Law in Spain and Andalucia.
markwilding
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Re: Scary stuff

Postby markwilding » Mon Nov 29, 2010 10:52 am

White Horse wrote::
If you default on your re-payment you could lose your home.

I'm not saying I''m not sympathetic to their problem but any British buyer should know this.
They say it's a time bomb, however, if loans aren't repaid because any foreigner can run away, the ultimate losers will be future foreign buyers because they'll have to pay a premium

AndaluzCampo
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Re: Scary stuff

Postby AndaluzCampo » Mon Nov 29, 2010 12:30 pm

The Chattertons, like anyone, anywhere, purchasing a luxury or expensive leisure item should accept full responsibility for their increased financial commitments.
However, it is the efficiency and effectiveness with which Spain is applying EU law to UK tabloid-portrayed home-owner victims which is the 'Scary stuff'.
And, in a wider context, the apparent lack of action, concern, efficiency and effectiveness or application of any law, EU or otherwise, which the UK or Spain is applying to resolve the atrocities commited against the UK, often pensioners, who have purchased and own their only home in Spain.
In many instances, these pensioners have suffered multiple abuses, having dealt, in good faith, with a network of individuals, be it builders, estate agents, promotors, vendors, town halls or lawyers, all of whom have responsibilities to abide by the law.
Are these home owners really expected to spend the rest of their retirement single-handedly sueing each one of the aforementioned in an attempt to put right the multitude of legal problems with their homes?
Why is there such an absence in the efficient and effective application of Spanish, UK or EU law in helping real victims of the Scary Property Scandal here in Spain?

markwilding
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Re: Scary stuff

Postby markwilding » Mon Nov 29, 2010 12:50 pm

Yes, but an individual suing a bank is always more difficult than the other way round no matter which country you're in.It shouldn't be that way I know

Jool
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Re: Scary stuff

Postby Jool » Mon Nov 29, 2010 4:12 pm

You stand to lose your home yes, but normally only the building you have mortgaged not all your EU wide assets, as seems to be the case! As I keep telling people who want to hand the keys in, don´t, do a dacion en pago and then the bank cannot pursue you.

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Re: Scary stuff

Postby Beachcomber » Mon Nov 29, 2010 5:02 pm

Are you sure that is correct Jool? If the property is in negative equity and its sale does not cover the amount of outstanding mortgage and expenses I believe the bank will pursue the debtor for the balance by whatever means available to them including overseas assets. Isn't this exactly what is happening to the people mentioned in the article?

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Re: Scary stuff

Postby Jim Allen » Mon Nov 29, 2010 5:45 pm

I just imagine that a Spaniard purchased a property here in the U.K
He couldnt pay his mortgage.
I just wonder if the lender would get the same result in Spain.

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julian
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Re: Scary stuff

Postby julian » Mon Nov 29, 2010 5:51 pm

if the lender is bright enough to use the same method to recover the money he previously lent the purchaser then yes he would get the same result, and quite rightly so.

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Re: Scary stuff

Postby Jim Allen » Mon Nov 29, 2010 5:58 pm

Well for a start it would probably take them 5 to 10 years and then of course there is the appeal :crazy:

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Re: Scary stuff

Postby julian » Mon Nov 29, 2010 6:04 pm

or maybe they would get struck down by a terminal illness just after starting the process. :crazy:

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Re: Scary stuff

Postby Devils Advocate » Mon Nov 29, 2010 6:07 pm

Well I'm glad at least one country is making strides to get back what is owed to them, what is wrong with that at the end of the day?...if I lent a bloke a grand on trust and he did a runner I'd find ways of getting it back, wouldn't you?

The problem, especially here in the UK is set to get worse too, there are a whole swage of people who have taken out virtually 0% mortgages and "own" properties that in all honesty they shouldn't as they can't afford to.

I know the banks take a fair amount of stick (from me as well) but it is the greedy people of this world who have snatched the money at these silly rates and will be stuffed once normality returns.....then they'll just plead "diplomatic immunity" in the hope of never having to pay it back..........which of course they'll have to :thumbup:

These cheap loans have in part been sponsored by savers to make the balance even more unfair. Jeez I decides to pay my mortgage off 10 years back for some stupid reason and feel a right mug now.

A fair way to equalise things in the fair world would be to pay 4% standard interest on savings accounts and put mortgages up to 4%............nice in theory but the repo men would be inundated.

Chap up the road from us thinks I'm a mug for paying off the mortgage when he gloatingly tells me what he pays.....thing is it'll be him who's moving to a council estate when things get back to normal not me :evil:

It is a bastrad though having to do the occasional deal and duck and dive to keep the capital growing a bit, as opposed to it just bringing a nice income in as generations before enjoyed......one way traffic in my mind and far from all the banks fault IMHO.
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julian
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Re: Scary stuff

Postby julian » Mon Nov 29, 2010 6:19 pm

now that post had an unusually high content of common sense (my posts included before you all start)
in this thread ! :thumbup:







(p.s...up the 0% to 100%) :wink:

Jool
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Re: Scary stuff

Postby Jool » Mon Nov 29, 2010 6:29 pm

Sorry Beach, I meant that this is peoplé´s understanding when they take out a mortgage that only the property mortgaged is the security (unless it is repossessed of course), however a dacion en pago does make an end to the debt.

Jool
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Re: Scary stuff

Postby Jool » Mon Nov 29, 2010 6:31 pm

I don´t agree its always the greedy people, there are many spaniards in serious trouble simply because they lost their job and have a mortgage........

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Re: Scary stuff

Postby Devils Advocate » Mon Nov 29, 2010 6:37 pm

Fair point Jool and in essence I'm not speaking about families/people who've hit hard times. I'm talking about people who leapt on the housing ladder and plumped for a place they could never have afforded with a normal 6-7% mortgage..............no thought of contigency planning built in................a 2 point rise and they're stuffed .Also with borrowing 100% the negative equity spectre is always there in this climate of stagnant prices.

It is an accepted fact (by the banks themselves) that banks have lent too much to people who will never be able to pay it back.........as per the original posters link.....scandalous :evil:
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frank
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Re: Scary stuff

Postby frank » Mon Nov 29, 2010 6:40 pm

Devils Advocate wrote:Well I'm glad at least one country is making strides to get back what is owed to them, what is wrong with that at the end of the day?...if I lent a bloke a grand on trust and he did a runner I'd find ways of getting it back, wouldn't you?

I think everyone here is in agreement, the bank should get their money back, it's just that it seems one way traffic. :D I bet before you lent someone a grand, you'd have checked him out, assured yourself that there was every chance of getting your money back, but banks, both in UK and Spain, were lending to just about everyone that asked. There were always going to be defaulters if things got bad, so I imagine they must be spending a lot of time and money trying to get their money back.
Anyway, what's the chance of you lending me a grand? :D I promise I'll pay you back! Honest! :angel:
Regards, Frank

No soy residente, simplemente un turista, ¿qué sé yo?

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Re: Scary stuff

Postby Devils Advocate » Mon Nov 29, 2010 6:43 pm

frank wrote:Anyway, what's the chance of you lending me a grand? :D I promise I'll pay you back! Honest! :angel:



Absolutely Zilch Frank :mrgreen:

Anyway I've heard you're only a quid behind the Aga Khan so you can doubly b***** off :D
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Re: Scary stuff

Postby frank » Mon Nov 29, 2010 6:50 pm

Devils Advocate wrote:[
Anyway I've heard you're only a quid behind the Aga Khan so you can doubly b***** off :D


I'd settle for a quid behind you! :lol:
Regards, Frank

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Re: Scary stuff

Postby Devils Advocate » Mon Nov 29, 2010 7:12 pm

Well, then you'd have 6 quid, 1 euro 29 centimos and a helicopter with a broken blade :lol:
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Jim Allen
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Re: Scary stuff

Postby Jim Allen » Tue Nov 30, 2010 9:58 pm

Information received
Assuming this is correct what now for those that feel it is right that a Spanish Bank can rip us off at will and we are powerless to get justice in Spain but they can get justice in the U.K.

( In answer to other comments.
No,the EEO cannot be used in the same way from the UK to a Spanish court.
Whoever said that Europe was a level playing field got it wrong.)

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DavidSearl
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Re: Scary stuff

Postby DavidSearl » Fri Dec 03, 2010 7:16 pm

FROM DAVID SEARL

FOR MALAGAMAN, JOOL, BEACHCOMBER, DEVILS ADVOCATE AND ALL POSTERS

Hot topic, what?

1. Regular participants in this Forum have already been warned here that such mechanisms are in place to enable cross-border orders to seize assets in another EU country.

2. All good posts, regarding people's eagerness to "get on the property ladder" and, we suppose, climb to the top.

3. As to the banks, an institution which offers 100 per cent mortgage loans or even 110 per cent in some cases at the height of the boom, without any real study of the borrower's ability to pay it back, is not a bank any more. It has become a gambler. Property speculation, like financial instrument speculation, is not what banks are supposed to do.

4. Their security was both the property and this ability to go after other assets if the property did not pay the entire debt due. This is called having your cake and eating it, too. In this way the bank can pretend it is not a speculator.

5. I like Devils Advocate when he refers to a carefully thought out situation which existed at some time in the Golden Age past. Right. When banks would only lend 50 per cent of appraised value to well-qualified borrowers. People saved up for a down payment. Anybody remember?

6. In the United States there is now a growing movement towards revising the mortgage law so that only the property itself stands as security for the loan. If the market drops, then the bank can lose, too. In this simple way, the bank will be encouraged to adopt a sensible, low-key lending policy. Business will slow down, of course, and fat commissions to bank loan officers will disappear.

7. This idea has even been mentioned by some here in Spain.

On we march, David Searl
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