Do You Know ????

Do you have a query on how to get things done in Andalucia, where to find things, who to call? Find out by posting and hear about others experiences.
BENIDORM
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Do You Know ????

Postby BENIDORM » Sat Sep 16, 2017 4:11 pm

SO....Do you know the history of your house in Spain?

For instance who lived there previously and did anything dramatic or unusual happen in your house?
And do you have any idea if any structure was there before your house was built ?
And in the area of your house do you know what happened 70, 100, 500 years ago + and do you care or have you ever even thought about it ?

I ask because you might actually be surprised and find it very interesting if you knew any of the above,for instance if you are in an old house have you ever thought about the families who were born, lived and probably died in your house.?
And do you have an imagination and can you guess the lifestyle of the inhabitants and think about the laughter and tears, joy and sadness, bad times and good times ?
As you maybe aware I'm really deeply interested in history and because of my knowledge and vivid imagination I can't help thinking and pondering about all of the above. :oops:
Maybe someone famous or infamous once inhabited your house or the space on which it was built.?
For example, I visited a Spanish friend sometime back and I knocked on their front door and they answered from a side door, I asked them why they don't use the front door...?
For a few moments there was a stony silence and then the Mother said ''My Grandfather was executed on the doorstep of the front door''....I didn't ask anymore details...
A few days later I spoke with the local historian, who is much more open, and he explained that the Grandfather was shot on the doorstep of his house in the 1930's by Franco's 'Maroc' Troops, because he had been named as a communist sympathiser .
So maybe your house etc could tell a tale from the past?
If you are frightened of ghosts it's probably not a good idea to follow my suggestions, but if you are not ..ask ..and I for one would be pleased to hear any of the stories you uncover.....
Regards,
Gordon

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chrissiehope
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby chrissiehope » Sat Sep 16, 2017 10:14 pm

I know some of the history of our casa - it was built by an olive farmer from Archidona. He & his wife lived in Archidona, and were expecting their first baby, but as the birth grew nearer, the wife contracted some kind of flu (?Spanish flu ?), and became seriously ill. She survived just long enough to give birth, and everyone said it was a miracle, so that's what they called the baby - Milagros. It was sometime after this that the farmer & his daughter Milagros moved to the campo & he built the house. It was just 'one up, one down', with a little kitchen on one side & a shed or storage room on the other, and he supported the upper floor with beams from a convent that was being refurbished. As Milagros grew up, she fell in love with Jose who lived across the campo. They married & moved to Villanueva de Algaidas & had several children. One of their sons had a furniture shop there, and he built & fitted our kitchen - his English was quite good, & it was he who told me the history. So in honour of his mother, and because of the ex-convent beams, we decided to call it Casa Milagros, & the name is proudly displayed by the front door :-)
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Pamela1
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby Pamela1 » Sat Sep 16, 2017 10:30 pm

Chrissiehope...lovely story.. :)

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IreneD
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby IreneD » Sat Sep 16, 2017 11:13 pm

I do know a little bit about our house. When we bought it, it was attached to a ruin next door. The ruin has since been demolished and a lovely new house, built in Andalucian style is there now - looking at it, you wouldn't know it wasn't an original old house, the builder used old doors, shutters, roof tiles etc. - spruced up of course ( I often think we must have been mad to buy what was a very unattractive property - the dilapidated ruin really gave our little corner a very run down look, we're so fortunate a builder bought the ruin and subsequently sold the beautiful new house to a very nice Dutch couple)

Next door on the other side is an old house, owned by an elderly local lady, although she lives elsewhere in the village. Not long ago, two other elderly ladies were standing outside the three houses, pointing and talking and I went out and asked if I could help. I wish I could have understood everything they said but basically they were reminiscing, as all 3 houses were once one house and owned by their large family, they had lots of brothers and sisters, they told me. A sister still owns the one to the left of ours. I asked them in, of course, and we chatted and they exclaimed at how different our little house was from the way they remembered our bit. One lady pointed at a window, it was her old bedroom, and said her novio used to throw stones at the window and she would sneak out, avoiding her strict father :)

That's all I know but one of these days, I hope to hear some more stories.

BENIDORM
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby BENIDORM » Sat Sep 16, 2017 11:26 pm

Chrissie and Irene,
Thank you for your stories, they are exactly what I wanted to hear.....

And I believe if you want to integrate and belong you must first understand the history of the people around you, and if you learn the history then the future becomes much clearer.
Regards,
Gordon

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IreneD
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby IreneD » Sat Sep 16, 2017 11:33 pm

That is so true, Gordon. Listening to the stories of our Spanish friends here gives us a much clearer picture of who they are.

BENIDORM
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby BENIDORM » Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:19 pm

Well I guess everyone is out asking their friends and neighbours about the history of their house and the neighbourhood. :)

But even if you are not that interested in history I hope that it has got you thinking about who inhabited your space before you and when you are walking down the street with a full belly and money in your pocket and smart clothing please try to imagine the days not so long ago when that just wasn't the case....

Regards,
Gordon

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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby Gasman » Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:43 pm

Not so much the history of our house but of a neighbour who told us that when he was young and going to school, he and his mates all went barefoot - he is pushing 80 now and so this was in Franco's days. It was the normal thing then so they never questioned it. They also NEVER questioned or gave cheek to anyone in authority, especially Guardia Civil, or you never knew what might happen to you or a family member ....

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gerryh
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby gerryh » Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:46 pm

I would love to know the history of my house.
It has been registered as a dwelling since 1940 and, I suspect, it is older than that.
Should have asked the elderly neighbours before they died. Most of the people now living here a relative new comers, even though the houses are old.
Cheers
Gerry
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olive
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby olive » Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:57 pm

Well we know quite a bit about our house. Like other houses in the area it has been added to and changed over the years. We are very friendly with the family that sold us the house. they had it from 1975. In those early days campo houses had no water or electric. The communal washing area and drinking source is a good mile away and must have been a trial on wash day(s). The wet washing was carried home on foot. Electric and water came about 35 years ago. That family had four children . three were good home births using the village midwife . She wasn't trained but had attended many births. Sadly the midwife died two years back at a good age. the fourth birth (number three) was difficult and her husband took her on the drovers route (most direct) to the local town 15km distant on a mule. That must have been a worrying journey. For worrying read horrendous. I have walked it several times.

Before that details were initially sketchy but one day we met a couple in the museum in Iznajar. they were from Madrid and holiday in the "home area" every year. We commented on the old implements and they made the connection that we lived in or near their old house.

Some time passed and one day out of the blue a couple turned up with an elderly relative . They were from Cadiz. The elderly relative used to live in our "house" back in the fifties. Then it was actually two single storey houses not interconnected. They presented us with a bottle of wine in the hope that they could have a look around and take in the changes we have made. We were only too pleased. They have visited a second time .

We had a builder in to make some changes we weren't able to. His dad came one day later with his elderly wife. She lived in our other half of the house until 1972 and pointed out where the open well used to be. Long since gone and totally unknown to the last owners. We keep expecting that area to collapse!

More time passed and we had a surprise visit from relatives of the Iznajar Museum Madrid couple. They brought their very elderly dad- 84 (all the way from Madrid!) to see the house he was born in. That was an excellent day. We had impromptu food and drink and learnt a lot of how the house was then and the surrounding area. There was a white and black fig tree (grafted maybe or two inter twined )growing on the front. Long since gone and repleced with an era (Threshing circle). The dad said he knew that a house existed on our property at least 130 years maybe 135 years ago.

No old photos of course but we have taken photos of each of the encounters to add to our extensive collection. I also photograph and document as best i can, the old ruins around us. They decay each year at such a rate like our house! That is a seperate story though.

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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby gavilan » Tue Sep 19, 2017 8:13 pm

I live in an old flour mill, reformado ... the miller's house was just a pile of rubble when I bought the land (the place had been abandoned 50 plus years before) .. the mill itself was more or less still standing but trees and weeds had taken over ... I literally dug out lots of old machinery and tools and found the original grindstones still there ... the family who owned the mill still live around here and I have a neighbour who worked here for a couple of years whilst the miller was drafted to the army ... I could say more but as they say 'it's all in the book" (search 'gavilan, axarquia')

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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby maureenscot » Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:18 pm

Very interesting Gavillan. Where do you live Gerry?

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gerryh
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby gerryh » Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:26 am

My approximate location is in my profile.
Not going to give my exact location on a public forum. :wave:
Cheers
Gerry
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BENIDORM
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby BENIDORM » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:34 am

Gerry,
I would suggest that the best way to discover the history of your house and surroundings is to seek out and chat with the ancients who frequent your nearest Pensioners Club, if you can distract their attention from domino playing they will I'm sure enlighten you and maybe the offer of a glass of vino will loosen their tongues even more.
Also local Town Hall and Churches have archives and if you show interest I'm sure that they will be helpful...

Olive, A Great essay and I'm able to award you 9/10 points for such a great effort... :lol:
A very interesting insight into the social history of campo dwellers and I've noticed that even though the 'locals' now choose to live in villages and towns they still have great pride in their past sometimes arduous and difficult previous lives.
It is good to try to preserve the history and also to collect such things as farm implements from another era.

Gavilan, Taking on the restoration task of such an old building must at times been most difficult, but ...Well done..!!

Gasman,
Your story highlights the difficult times from not so long ago, and so many younger people don't know these facts and I've noticed that when I've tried to tell youngsters about the past hardships, they actually do seem to appreciate what they now have., and don't take everything for granted....

And I'm curious...is anyone really not interested in this subject ?.

Regards,
Gordon

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RichardCoeurdeLion
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby RichardCoeurdeLion » Sat Sep 23, 2017 1:41 pm

Lovely stories everyone.

The little house we had had no real history as it was just a holiday place on an urbanisation. It was built in the 70s.
The original owners were a Dutch couple Mr and Mrs Ollgard. We bought off them when they got to old to visit. We eventually sold it to the next door neighbour and he knocked thru and bricked up the front door. It doesn't look like a separate house now.

I think everyone should compile a book of their house, which could be passed down to each owner, with details of the hatchlings, matchings and dispatchings and other things that have happened there.

Our current house in uk was built in 99. I bought a brick with 1999 on and got the brickie to put it in a prominent place.

BENIDORM
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby BENIDORM » Sun Sep 24, 2017 1:49 pm

Richard,
That is a great idea for previous occupiers to pass on a book about what they know about the house and hopefully they will add to it.

I'm always trying to encourage people to talk with their relatives about what has happened in the family and interesting facts about their lives and it's good to make notes and with photographs it is a good idea to write some details on the back, I've got a box full of family photos and haven't got a clue about the identity of some, and I know many family photos are discarded for this reason when someone 'passes on'.
Now it is really easy to trace family history, with so many archives becoming available, and I've been researching our family histories for many years and some really great characters are appearing..fascinating 'stuff'!
Anyway members, please keep adding your stories, they don't have to be pages long , just a few lines can be interesting to most, well certainly to me ! :thumbup:

Regards,
Gordon..

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chrissiehope
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby chrissiehope » Sun Sep 24, 2017 10:55 pm

OK, here's another one for you :-) The student house we have in Manchester, is the end of a terrace of 7 houses. In the back yard, built into the wall, low down & near a drain, is an unusual 'brick'. It is like a plaque and it has a bas relief of a man's face. He has a flowing beard & moustache, and looks like a 'Green Man'. I have spent many hours trying to discover the significance, if any, of this, but without success. I did discover various things about the house - it was built between 1901 & 1905 (looked at old maps) & this side of the terrace was built first, the other side being quite a bit later. The land was originally owned by a wealthy family from Yorkshire. The builder had a relative (I think it was a brother) who owned & ran a Billiards Hall which was behind the property - some of this info came from the deeds, and the rest from my researches. I'm going to try & post a photo of the 'Green Man' - you never know, someone on here might know something about it ! Can't find it, so I'll keep looking & post when I do find it !
Alexandr for President (Squire for PM !)

Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
Inside of a dog it's too dark to read (Groucho Marx)

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chrissiehope
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby chrissiehope » Mon Sep 25, 2017 9:47 am

Found it !

Image

Image

The photo isn't very clear, so I've added the sketch I did. I think we have since painted it to make it clearer, but I'm not sure if we took a photo afterwards

(for those who don't know - clicking on the image will take you to the postimages site where you can see a larger version)
Alexandr for President (Squire for PM !)

Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
Inside of a dog it's too dark to read (Groucho Marx)

BENIDORM
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby BENIDORM » Mon Sep 25, 2017 10:52 am

Hello Chrissie,
Interesting.!
I am aware of many possible reasons why you would have this plaque in your wall.
First I would call it a 'Grotesque' image/figure, similar to figures found on German Wine/Beer ceramic bottles ( Bellarmine)..spelling from memory.
The obvious reason would be that it is the mark-logo of the brick-maker or the actual brick-layer/-brick setter, and as this is an Edwardian house the builder would be Victorian trained and they took a great pride in their work , so 'signed' them like an artist would sign a painting.
What is confusing is the fact that it is on a rear rough brick wall, most of this type of plaque that I've seen would be on the front, and often you can see plaques bearing titles like 'Elma Villas' quite grand titles for terrace houses.!
It could also represent the actual original owners family crest or logo, and if you like a fanciful idea it could be that it marks the spot where hidden treasure hides, but is a 'key' stone and if you remove it the building will collapse, similar to devices set in Pyramids. :shock:
Anyway that's all that comes to mind at the moment.
Hope that it gives 'food for thought'
Regards,
Gordon

olive
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Re: Do You Know ????

Postby olive » Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:41 am

couple of things you could try.

search by image on google

or

search by reverse image on https://www.tineye.com/


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