EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Information and questions about the Law in Spain and Andalucia.
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tjtops
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EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby tjtops » Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:13 pm

Before everyone starts, I KNOW the EHIC is supposed to be a short-term fallback, used only for emergencies..... (in the absence of private healthcare or the wherewithal to pay privately)...but can a health centre (where you previously registered when in legitimate possession of a tarjeta sanitaria -- now expired) refuse to treat you? Or even let you keep an appointment already made (via the junta's telephone service, when TS number was required and accepted) unless you produce your ORIGINAL NIE, passport etc along with your EHIC?? :evil:
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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby katy » Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:48 pm

Yes they can and do turn people away who do not produce an EHIC. Have seen it happen. Also at the Hospital, no card, they want a credit card!

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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby tjtops » Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:57 pm

No Katy...that's the point....she HAD a current EHIC card.....
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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby katy » Wed Feb 17, 2010 3:14 pm

Oh sorry :oops: I am not sure but they are much stricter now than before. I have heard that in La Cala they have refused to see some on EHIC cards if it's suspected they live in Spain. Could be like most administration in Spain they change the rules from place to place!

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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby peteroldracer » Wed Feb 17, 2010 11:54 pm

tjtops wrote: Before everyone starts, I KNOW the EHIC is supposed to be a short-term fallback,

No, it is not.
It is a way that bonafide short term visitors can get emergency treatment without having to pay up front in any European country, by proving they are entitled to state health care in their own country. Once you leave the UK and reside in another country, you must deregister with the NHS, and you then lose your entitlement to free treatment within the UK, other than as a short-term visitor to the UK. You may be entitled to an EHIC whilst resident in Spain, under the E121 scheme, and this is (from May) issued by the UK overseas healthcare folk in Newcastle.
If only the UK would refuse to issue E109 or E121 documents without proof that the applicant had deregistered with the NHS, there would be less fiddling!
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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby tjtops » Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:41 am

The latest is.....she went back yesterday with her 'original' NIE certificate, issued in 2004....and was told that it wouldn't do....she had to have a new one (certificate)......despite being already registered at the health centre, a process done with the 'original' NIE in 2005.....
So apart from being steaming mad (and unlikely to get even, it seems :crazy: ) how do you renew your NIE?? Where?/ And how much does it cost?? (I'd like to know too, cos mine is also 'old'......)
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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby katy » Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:58 am

Is it possible she is misunderstanding what they are asking for? I have accompanied friends with a EHIC and they were on holiday, they don't even have an NIE. When making an appointment they produce the card and are given a form to fill in, that's all. Thousands of non-residents get treated every year and don't have these documents. Maybe try another health centre.

AFAIK an NIE never needs renewing.

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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby Lavanda » Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:06 pm

"If only the UK would refuse to issue E109 or E121 documents without proof that the applicant had deregistered with the NHS, there would be less fiddling!"

We did not give up our EHIC cards. We thought it best to hang on to them as SOME sort of cover, until we got our cover here under the E106 and then the E121. Believe it, or not, but last week we actually got our piece of paper and our named Doctor in our village. It took THREE YEARS, dozens of copies of passports, NIEs, residencias and padrons and a team of people in Newcastle, Madrid, Málaga and Cáceres to get this done. Thank goodness we are healthy and never needed a Doctor in all that time.

I would not advise anyone to give up their UK issued EHIC until they have the Spanish entitlement in the hand. Otherwise they have nothing ... and ... possibly nothing for many years.

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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby tjtops » Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:11 pm

It's definitely the NIE that's the problem. She has one because, like me, she has a house etc etc here although she only uses it for holidays.....
I'm sure I've seen somewhere about the NIE certificate having to be renewed, but I don't know where I saw it....so where better to ask than on here!!! We both want to know how, where etc etc please!!!
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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby El Cid » Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:23 pm

tjtops wrote:It's definitely the NIE that's the problem. She has one because, like me, she has a house etc etc here although she only uses it for holidays.....
I'm sure I've seen somewhere about the NIE certificate having to be renewed, but I don't know where I saw it....so where better to ask than on here!!! We both want to know how, where etc etc please!!!


NIE certificates are not renewable - they are issued for life.

She may be referring to the new Certificate of Registration which also shows your NIE number.

Incidentally, if you hold a UK EHIC and cease being resident in the UK it must be returned. In the absence of an E106 or E121 then you have no health cover at all and the only option is private health insurance.

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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby peteroldracer » Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:45 pm

El Cid wrote:
tjtops wrote: if you hold a UK EHIC and cease being resident in the UK it must be returned.

This was correct Sid, but this year things change, so that residents here in Spain getting health care through E106 or E121 will shortly be getting a form from Newcastle, inviting them to apply for an EHIC, as the country accepting responsibility for the person's healh care costs must issue the EHIC, not the country where they are resident as now. My OH has hers, and I have been emailed by Nescastle to say mine (as dependant) will be with me shortly. What is not clear at the moment is how long they will be valid - one year as the Spamish-issued ones were, or five years as the UK ones are.
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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby El Cid » Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:50 pm

peteroldracer wrote:
El Cid wrote:
tjtops wrote: if you hold a UK EHIC and cease being resident in the UK it must be returned.

This was correct Sid, but this year things change, so that residents here in Spain getting health care through E106 or E121 will shortly be getting a form from Newcastle, inviting them to apply for an EHIC, as the country accepting responsibility for the person's healh care costs must issue the EHIC, not the country where they are resident as now. My OH has hers, and I have been emailed by Nescastle to say mine (as dependant) will be with me shortly. What is not clear at the moment is how long they will be valid - one year as the Spamish-issued ones were, or five years as the UK ones are.


True but you are missing my point.

It is only residents of Spain who have an E121 who can get the EHIC this way.

If you are not a pensioner and live in the UK you can get one in the normal way in the UK but you will have to return it when you come to Spain - UNLESS you are a pensioner with an E121/106 and then you get it from Newcastle.

So non pensioners living in Spain cannot get any health care.

Sid

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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby tjtops » Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:57 pm

She may be referring to the new Certificate of Registration which also shows your NIE number.


1. What is this?? I thought that this is for residents?
2. And please..I promise you.......the health centre is ADAMANT she has to get a new NIE certificate -- 'autorizado'.... and someone else I've spoken to says the same: the actual physical certificate apparently 'expires' after a certain number of years...no idea how many..the number stays the same...but you have to go to 'somewhere' and get a new certificate. Nothing at all to do with residency. Maybe I'd be better startting a new thread just with this question???
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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby katy » Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:27 pm

But it doesn't need renewing, neither do they need an NIE to get treatment with an EHIC. Do you think the Health centre suspect she is a resident and are placing obstacles in their way?

BTW they can refuse ongoing treatment with an EHIC if it is not an emergency. A few have been told they need to see a specialist but they should return to their home country for this. At the hospital they write EHIC on the top of the diagnosis sheets.

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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby Lavanda » Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:38 pm

... but Sid, our E106 and then E121 was NOT absent. We had them. We just had the problem that the people here in Extremadura did not know what they were or what to do with them. Not everyone lives in an ex-pat community in Spain. I's like to see the DW&P do an Open Evening here!!!

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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby Paula » Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:44 pm

Highly unlikely being as they want an audience to talk to! You will have to come to Fuengirola.

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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby Paula » Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:46 pm

First I have heard of needing to get a new NIE certificate, remembering I get stopped by the Guardia almost weekly, I would have thought they would have pointed this out, mine is 12yrs old.

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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby Jool » Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:54 pm

Yes I am hearing more and more about a renewed NIE........with current address on yet I do not have one............and I have asked about getting one just in case and been told you cannot do something that is not necessary....

I would just go to another Health Centre with the EHIC card or grab a Ryanair cheapie......

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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby katy » Thu Feb 18, 2010 2:07 pm

But in this case it is for a TOURIST...how many tourists have an NIE? only the ones owning property or renting.

BTW La Cala Health centre has interpreters should be clearer there.

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Re: EHIC...can you be refused treatment?

Postby tjtops » Thu Feb 18, 2010 4:58 pm

She's a bit more than a tourist...but defo NOT a fulltime resident. She has an NIE because she owns a property, car etc here...all she wants is to be able to see a doc IF necessary. There are -- as far as I know -- no looming health issues. Some people simply can't afford private healthcare at the moment....here OR UK....and through no fault of their own :(
But I guess the comment about 'obstacles' is pretty near the mark!
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