Potencia Contratada and ICP Rating

[Granite]

I noted with some pleasure that my last electricity bill included a reduction of 25% for “ Descuento bono Social.” This is because our Potencia contratada is only 2.2kW. We do have problems with tripping occasionally but nothing that cannot be managed.
However, I also note that the ICP on the consumer panel has a rating of 20A. On the basis that Watts = Volts x Amps it would appear that the ICP should be rated at 10A or am I (hopefully!) missing something?

[Lyric]

I think you are right. Mine is 30A for 6.9 contracted.

[gerryh]

Correct, you are contracted for 2,2 KW and should have an 10A ICP.
You could tell them that you have a 20A ICP fitted and would like your contract increased to 4.4 KW and hence pay a higher monthly standing charge and loose the discount.
Or you could keep quite because you don't understand the significance of the rating on an ICP.
Cheers
Gerry

[El Cid]

Just keep quiet about it.

When I built my house we had a bolletin for 15kw and asked for a similar supply. At that time an ICP was not required if you were on the dual tariff. All the paperwork for a 15kw supply was submitted and for the next 6 years we were charged for a 4.93kw supply. I have no idea how they came up with that figure.

That all changed when they changed the rules and we had to fit a 60A ICP.

It was good while it lasted!

Sid

[ashtondav]

At "peak times" I wish to run 3 2Kw heaters, TV and lights, with occasional use of water heater and kettle.

Does that mean I need a potencia of about 8KW to avoid occasional "trips"? Whats the significance of amps (A). Sorry for technical ignorance...

[gerryh]

What is the rating of the ICP you have fitted?
Has it tripped yet?
Cheers
Gerry

[Wicksey]

Where is the 'ICP on the consumer panel'? Is that something within the bill?

We have just had the new format of bill which does show 'Peage de acceso 2.0A' which we weren't sure what it was.

We don't have an ICP as far as we can see. In our fuse box we just have switches for the different fuses in the house and at one end there's a large hole where presumable the ICP would be? We had a bolitin done when we bought the house a few years ago and the electrician said that Endesa would contact us about the ICP but they haven't. I have also read that you are fined for not having one but again I cannot see that on the bill. There are two charges for potencia and energia, impuesto electricidad, alquiler equipos and IVA. Is this normal?

[Lyric]

That's it Mrs W, you have the Circuit Breakers for the various - the things that trip with your hairdryer and the fire on together, then on the left , in that hole goes another similar looking wotsit which has the rating etc writ on it and is sealed by Endesa. It could also go in your meter box.

Just looked mine does say it is an ICP in tiny writing on it.

[Wicksey]

It is highly unlikely we would ever go over our 4.4kw potencia anyway and we have never tripped out as we don't have any high usage items such as a cooker or kettle etc.

[Granite]

Many thanks for your replies to my original post.
When we bought the property some 7 years ago and before moving in we had work done including the installation of an electric water heater. I have just checked the electrician’s bill and one item is for “Cambiar ICP a 20A”. At the time there was no mention of any issues around our contracted supply. The ICP cover plate whilst having screws with holes to allow a seal to be installed, has no seal. I cannot remember whether there were seals fitted before the work was carried out.
When our meter is eventually replaced as part of the ongoing meter replacement programme two questions arise.
1. I believe the new smart meters will incorporate an automatic ICP which in our case will be limited to 2.2kW. I would therefore at this stage have to apply for an increased Potencia. Is this something a local electrician can carry out before formally changing the contract with the supply company?
2. As part of the smart meter installation will our higher than contacted Potencia/ICP Rating be noted and what are the potential consequences even if I play dumb.?

[ashtondav]

It is highly unlikely we would ever go over our 4.4kw potencia anyway and we have never tripped out as we don't have any high usage items such as a cooker or kettle etc.

Well we trip evry morning with two rads and a hairdryer. Can someone tell me if we would be alright given 3 x 2kw heaters, water heater and kettle if we contracted for 8KW potencia?

[gerryh]

You haven't answered my previous question as to what is the rating of your ICP.
When you say you trip every morning, what trips, the ICP, ELCB, MCB or what?
Cheers
Gerry

[peteroldracer]

See the thread "Increasing potencia"

[ashtondav]

Sorry Gerry, I just have a fuse box with various switches for kitchen, pool etc. Where is the ICP?

[gerryh]

OK, as you don't know where the ICP is then obviously that is not what is tripping.
So increasing your contracted potencia will, probably, not help.
So, what is tripping the ELCB or one of the MCBs?
Cheers
Gerry

[Stevemul]

I love this talking in acronyms Gerry, you must have been in Education!

[Granite]

Checked the “Increasing Potencia” thread which did not really answer my questions.
If a new smart meter is installed and no work is carried out in the house it will be set to our contracted potencia of 2.2kW. We will then have the electrical system tripping very frequently!
At some stage we will need to formally increase the potencia to 4.6 kW (ICP 20A) which is what is installed now – apparently unofficially. There are no seals on the ICP cover. Are we likely to open ourselves up to back charges?
Can a “Boletin” be provided by any electrician and can an electrician upgrade an ICP prior to formal application to the supplier?
Sorry if I am being overly cautious but I just want to get a view on the likely scenarios so I can decide what to do. For example, wait till the summer, get the original electrician back, replace the 20A ICP with a 10A ICP and then apply for an increase in potencia.

[gerryh]

To get your potencia upgraded you will almost definitely require an up to date bolletin.
Don't worry about the fact you have a 20Amp ICP already.
After the potencia has been upgraded Endesa will send someone to check the ICP rating and seal the box.
If a Smart meter is installed then it has an inbuilt ICP so the ICP inside your switchboard isn't really needed.
Cheers
Gerry

[peteroldracer]

What I was referring to was the probability that other work will be needed to the supply. We were quoted several thousand € to upgrade, involving laying a second tube for cabling, a new transformer and so on, so get an official estimate from Endesa or whoever your supplier is. We were able to find a compromise and got our supply increased to a usable level but not the 9kwh we wanted.

[Granite]

Many thanks for your advice. Hopefully any work on our system will be limited as I doubt it is more than 10 years old. To me it seems very modern with automatic circuit breakers as opposed to a fuse you have to pull out and fit a hairpin to!
Thanks again.