W.F.A.

[BENIDORM]

Not sure if anyone else has mentioned this....?

It now looks definite that the Winter Fuel Allowance will not be paid from 2015 , this week the Government laid a new regulation before Parliament excluding Spain and other countries from receiving the payment....It is unlikely to be challenged ...

Another good reason for Expats not to vote for the present Government in the future ?
And another good reason to 'upsticks' and return to the UK ?....

You are still entitled to claim this years payment if you have not already done so ..( claim by March 2015 I think)

Regards,
Gordon

[Miro]

I can think of plenty of reasons to "upsticks" etc., but losing 200 quid a year isn't one of them.
Personally, I'd be happy to vote for any mob who proposed doing away with such a stupid & controversial thing as the WFP altogether, for everybody.
I wonder how much would be saved by not paying 200 quid to everyone over 60, and instead increasing the Xmas bonus from £10 to £210 to everyone in receipt of their state pension? I'd like to see that calculation.

[Nimrod]

The WFA is worked by household,not a full allowance to every eligible person in it.
So in our case I get £100.00 and Mrs N gets £100,00.
I daresay there are many households where each eligible person is getting the full whack.
you have to be dishonest though,

[BENIDORM]

Miro, I do agree with you, it wouldn't be a major decision for me also, if I was considering returning to UK, however for many others it may be the 'Last Straw' and I did hear a group of expats talking about this only the other day.

And there are quite a few living here below the 'bread Line', so 200 pounds is a big loss to them...

Wouldn't it be a nice idea if the Xmas Bonus was uplifted for everyone instead ?

I could also argue that there is a principle at stake here too !

Regards,
Gordon.

[Miro]

Good point Nimrod; so you only have to increase the Xmas bonus to £110 per pensioner (to keep their vote)

Using some very approximate figures sourced by Googling, I reckon my plan could save the government around 3 quarters of a billion quid a year. Would stripping those over 60 but below state pension age of their WFA be a deal breaker when it comes to election time? Surely if it makes that much difference to them, they should still be working (in which case why give them any benefits?) or they're receiving other benefits already anyway?

[gerryh]

What gets me about the "reasoning" behind the idea to scrap WFA for those who live in Spain is that Spain is a hot country.
Those of us who actually live full time in Spain no that, in some pats of Spain, winters are a lot colder than most places in the UK.
I would be in favour of means testing the WFA irrespective of where in the world you live, but it probably costs more to administrator than the actual WFA.
Cheers
Gerry

[Miro]

Spot on Gerry. My savings estimates are probably conservative, because they don't take into consideration the wasted admin time & cost paying out a superfluous benefit. It could be combined with the Xmas bonus to pensioners without any additional admin.

[Devils Advocate]

I agree Gerry about it being means tested too, or handed in out in actual fuel vouchers.

TV, media and forums must share part of the blame though I guess. The countless "life in the sun" type programmes were telling people about the 365 days a year sunshine, the countless people on forums saying how much warmer it is than the UK, ie "It's lovely in November/December but you may need a fleece after 9" and all that rubbish.

If you've paid you dues like I know you have then you should get whatever people get in the UK, and yes I've been uncomfortably cold in Spain in April, somehow it's never as uncomfortable in the UK, probably due to the way the houses are built and more importantly how they're equipped.

[Miro]

I know it's not in the EU so wouldn't count anyway, but this time of year the sun shines virtually 24 hours a day in Antarctica - so by some definitions obviously it's not cold there either!
Means testing would be one solution, but also open to criticism and additional admin. Nope, think I'll stick to my ticket. Now, for an encore, I think I'll fix the immigration/benefits "problem"....

[olive]

Periodically I pop up ( to be ridiculed ) and say that I am afraid that things are going to get much worse for the Uk populace and their benefits. The reason is the deficit is still burgeoning and is now way beyond reasonable. So something has to give. Benefits, pensions, working age, taxation levels.

The current lower tax take for lower average wages, fuel prices etc is part of the problem. Problem is no government will have the guts to initiate substantial action. It will be crisis led.

So I don't ever expect WFA. I do expect a lower state pension than currently touted.

That being the case pensions and benefits for EU countries with less bouyant economies than the UK look pretty much basket cases in comparison.

[anyroads]

WFA is small fry......

It is only a matter of time before charges are brought in for the NHS, AND old age pensions are cut back. The £10 or whatever it is, Christmas bonus will be a fond memory. Whoever thought this up ?. Not sure if it would buy two drinks in my local tonight.

anyroads

[katy]

I agree Gerry about it being means tested too, or handed in out in actual fuel vouchers.

TV, media and forums must share part of the blame though I guess. The countless "life in the sun" type programmes were telling people about the 365 days a year sunshine, the countless people on forums saying how much warmer it is than the UK, ie "It's lovely in November/December but you may need a fleece after 9" and all that rubbish.

If you've paid you dues like I know you have then you should get whatever people get in the UK, and yes I've been uncomfortably cold in Spain in April, somehow it's never as uncomfortable in the UK, probably due to the way the houses are built and more importantly how they're equipped.

Agree, you can still watch it now. Wannabees saying they want to live where they can wear shorts in December, saying is that fireplace ever used etc. ok. The weather is better, just that the houses are cold.

I would like to see the fuel allowance and Xmas bonus abolished. Just a better basic pension.....for those who have paid into the system.
Can't see any PM having the balls to stop the Xmas bonus, would be like Maagie Thatcher the milk snatcher

[anyroads]

Watched a bit of "Skint" based in Grimsby last night...

Someone has to pay for the feckless, unemployable, drug addicts.

No wonder people are queuing up at Calais !


anyroads

[katy]

Well if you get old and not able to care for yourself the ones who have been prudent, own their own house, have savings etc. have to pay for their care in a home. However, if you have squandered your earnings and only have a state pension then the state foots the bill for a care home. Not much incentive is there. Someone who entered the country a year ago can dump their elderly dependants in a home all paid for. Whilst we suckers pay through the nose that is why I think the WFA should not be means tested.

I can't watch those benefits RUs programmes....and WTF do they need food banks on generous benefits.

[Manchesteral]

I would never sell my U K property to live abroad, however I am considering spending a good portion of my year there when I retire in 16 months time.
I don't think the winter fuel allowance would bother me one way or another, but the general status of good old England currently leaves something to be desired as far as quality of life is concerned, in my opinion anyway, Every time I open a newspaper people are stabbing each other claiming benefits for fatherless broods or generally at odds with each other !
To be honest it can't be any worse in Spain providing one has a reasonable level of pension/ income, we are seriously contemplating it !

[anyroads]

I can't watch those benefits RUs programmes....and WTF do they need food banks on generous benefits.

.

Don't be silly katy...

Benefits are for drugs, fags, and booze...

anyroads

[Wicksey]

I feel sorry for those who have retired to other countries including commonwealth ones like Canada and Australia who do not get the yearly increases. There was an article in the press a couple of months ago:

"if you move to one of more than 100 countries around the world your state pension is frozen at the date you retire or of your arrival there, and never increases – no matter how rich or poor you are, or how much you have paid in national insurance."

I can never understand that, and for someone who retired 10 or 15 years ago their pension will not be worth much now. I must admit I don't expect to get the WFA and the way they keep moving on my 'retirement' age to receive my state pension, that seems like it's never getting any closer anyhow.

Just read this article too
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... tions.html

[ValL]

My town house is perishing in the winter, costs a fortune to heat and most of that is wasted. I would not be eligible for any heating allowance anyway. Don't miss what you never had. Never wasted my time thinking I would qualify for any benefits either, when I really could have been done with something we got 65pence heating allowance for 2 primary school boys. I told them to stick as they obviously needed it more than me. A bag of coal was nearly 3 pounds then. I won't freeze, I won't be comfortable either, there many worse off than me.

[Free at Last]

Well if you get old and not able to care for yourself the ones who have been prudent, own their own house, have savings etc. have to pay for their care in a home. However, if you have squandered your earnings and only have a state pension then the state foots the bill for a care home. Not much incentive is there. Someone who entered the country a year ago can dump their elderly dependants in a home all paid for. Whilst we suckers pay through the nose that is why I think the WFA should not be means tested.

Average pre-tax earnings (not benefits) in the UK are 26.5K, meaning that those in jobs where the pay is below average will be getting much less. With the average cost of residential care for the elderly now running at 28.5k per year (and 37.5k if nursing care is needed), how is anyone on average or below average pay expected to amass enough in savings to fund their own care? The situation is only going to get worse as fewer and fewer people can now afford to buy their own homes (which people currently have to sell to fund their care home fees, or have the sale deferred until their death when the fees have to be repaid to the local authority) but have to rent all their lives - often with the assistance of Housing Benefit even if they are working. They will have to go on claiming Housing Benefit after they retire whereas a large proportion of earlier generations had paid off their mortgages by the time they retired, and had the option to downsize to free up equity, or sell up to pay for their care if necessary.

By the way, when the Xmas Bonus was introduced back in 1972, the basic state pension was only 6.75 per week so the bonus was worth more than a week's pension. It must cost many times more than the benefit people feel from receiving 10 pounds now to administer the payments.

[Free at Last]

Something to ponder on regarding the cost of paying WFA to expats - the cost of paying the allowance to claimants in all EU countries last winter was 21M.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/pers ... ments.html

It has been reported that the Qatari ruling family is to be sent a bill for 38M after using an aggressive tax avoidance scheme to get out of paying stamp duty when they bought the former Chelsea Barracks (it remains to be seen whether they will actually pay it, however).

Perhaps closer scrutiny of such schemes could yield more money for the Exchequer than cracking down on benefit claimants.