Air Tax Up

[Grouser]

Lis48, The tokenism of the air tax aside, what are your views on global dimming?

[lis48]

Grouser, I was wary of getting off topic but now that you´ve raised it.....
Global dimming is the effect of REDUCED solar radiation that reaches the earth´s surface and is directly caused by pollution. It is thought to have been behind the droughts of the Sahel on the 1970´s and 1980´s because the pollutants seed clouds so changing their optical properties and affecting rainfall patterns. It is now known to COUNTEREACT the effects of global warming which explains why world temps decreased between 1945 and 1975 when pollutants were increasing, but increased between 1975 and 2005 when we were restricting pollutants. The two effects balance each other out as nature tends to do, so I can not see how JUST reducing carbon emissions will prevent global warming. In fact it seems to me that it will increase it. It´s not just a simple matter of "Lets all decrease carbon emissions and we will save the world from global warming" as was thought in the 90s. Hence the need to refer to "climatic change" not "global warming" as being the problem. Well you asked my view....

[Grouser]

My understanding of global dimming is that the main cause of it is aeroplane trails reflecting sunlight and heat back into space. This was hammered home after the September 11th incident when all planes in North America were grounded for several days and climatologists in the states noticed a sudden increase in sunlight intensity. This was then linked to research that had been going on in Israel where long term studies of sunlight and crop growing had tracked a 15% decrease in light levels since the early sixties. Hence increased air traffic is in fact masking just how much climate change is taking place due to carbon dioxide emissions. The message there then is better to fly than drive, but also that the problem is being considerably understated.

[lis48]

Exactly. I totally agree. So the message is that without the increase in air traffic and consequent air pollution, global warming would have been much greater. So why are we so obsessed with reducing air traffic if it is actually delaying the "destruction of the planet " predicted in the 80´s? We should be focussing on climatic change, understanding the interrelationships that cause it, and stop panicking the public with the idea that the earth is heating up and the ice caps will melt and everyone will drown in boiling seas. That is only one small aspect of climatic change. In the 60´s, we were all told to be scared of nuclear destruction, in the 70´s of world population explosion, then supplies of natural resources were going to run out in the 80´s, global warming scared us in the 90´s and global dimming in the early 2000´s. Now I suppose the scare is polonium which few had even heard of a few weeks ago. The GCSE/A level Geography syllabus has gone through a similar change so I expect environmental radiation to be the main topic in 2 or 3 years. I shall go and write some A level questions on it for the board now I think......

[Faire d'Income]

lis48,

with respect if I was to bang on about VOCs, TEWI, GWP etc etc then most people switch off so it is far easier to hang your hat on generic terms such as global warming which others can at least identify with, if not understand.

[fincalospinos]

By 2012, the plants in three key countries - China, India, and the United States - are expected to emit as much as an extra 2.7 billion tons of carbon dioxide, according to a Monitor analysis of power-plant construction data. In contrast, Kyoto countries by that year are supposed to have cut their CO2 emissions by some 483 million tons.

I dont think that £5 extra on each short haul flight is going to alter global warming. It is just another of Gordon Browns stealth taxes.

When are UK voters going to wake up and get rid of this corrupt, inept, bankrupt bunch of failed ex social workers and teachers who are an excuse for government ?

[katy]

Who would replace them ? they all seem an inept bunch.

[Valencia_Paul]

... this corrupt, inept, bankrupt bunch of failed ex social workers and teachers who are an excuse for government ?

Sounds like Zapatero's government in Spain.

[fincalospinos]

Who would replace them ? they all seem an inept bunch.

Katy, I wish I knew. Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be a viable alternative, but anything would be better than this lot.
Perhaps we should get away from traditional political parties with their whip systems, and replace them with truly independent Representatives, who are accountable only to their constituencies, and who vote according to the wishes of their constituents.
With the advent of the Internet general consensus can now be quickly and easily accessed.

[katy]

Great idea, I have always thought that too.

[JAWG]

Not really.
It will be mainly the vocal minority that will reply. So it will be more government to suit the minorities.

[Grouser]

'It doesn't matter who you vote for, the government always gets in'

[nevada smith]

not bad, grouser, not bad...

[Solysombra]

Back to the air tax, apparently it is going to be a logistical nightmare trying to collect extra tax from air-travellers who have already booked flights. It seems that air-line staff are supposed to collect it , no cash only credit/debit cards, more queuing, no doubt.
Mind, just arrived back from 10 day trip to Spain to find petrol has shot up 5p per litre, but then we found that Granada drinks prices had shot up as well since July.
Going to Prague for Xmas markets next week, no doubt everything will have trebled in price knowing my luck.

be sure to spend a few pleasant hours in "Ufleku"

[toddcl]

Going to Prague for Xmas markets next week, no doubt everything will have trebled in price knowing my luck.[quote

Friend just done the Christmas tour. They said the place was empty and the food lousy along with very expensive as they are trying to ramp up prices from the few who are there.

Hope it's changed by the time you get there.

[concorde]

Thanks toddcl,
been researching Prague before we go tomorrow, the biggest rip-off seems to be the taxi's, but have found an UK/Prague site that gives fixed prices from airport. Also money exchange scams on streets are big.

Talking of rip-offs, Liverpool airport are thinking of charging every passenger £2 before going through security. this new 'scam' is to cover the high cost of security etc. checking for liquids etc. The charge will be taken through a turnstile with £ coins!
I bet it was thought up by that nice security man who confiscated my new sealed bottle of H.P sauce, but after examining a glass jar full of coloured wood wax let that through!
Still the wax wouldn't have tasted so good on his morning bacon buttie.

[Valencia_Paul]

Leaving Manchester airport for Spain a couple of weeks ago I had a couple of sealed 200 ml cartons of baby milk for our little boy. We had to open these, pour into a bottle and taste them in front of security. We had the option to demonstrate that the baby would drink it instead of one of us.

I found it absurd and annoying. Surely if I was going to blow up the plane with said liquids I wouldn't mind drinking a bit or even giving junior that option since I would killing him anyway by blowing up the plane.

Thankfully there was no such nonsense returning from Alicante airport.
I find the staff at Manchester airport very officious and no wonder the place is full of signs warning of severe penalties for belting any of the staff.

[Solysombra]

Concorde, I can guarantee you a great time in Prague if you follow my golden rules, when you take a taxi ALWAYS ask the driver to write down the cost before embarking on the journey, use the tram system whenever you can, it's old but pretty efficient, NEVER change money in the street, use a bank or your hotel, the food in Prague is exceptional provided you keep away from any fancy looking places, make sure you spend several hours a day quaffing in Ufleku, Ive been to Prague 7 times and it's a great trip

[nevada smith]

U Fleku also has a website in english at www.ufleku.cz

[concorde]

Thanks for the tips Solysombra,
Found a great sight, www.locallingo.com. (sorry don't know how to do links) Complete with audio, so I am now fluent in Czech in ordering beer, saying sorry, thank you, and perhaps one tongue-twister I will not use. 'Tell Godfather Paul, he is putting too much pepper on my pork'.

Forgot to mention earlier, at Liverpool airport they let me through security with 2 plastic bottles of wine, but confiscated my shampoo, let us through with (after examining closely) 3 large plastic yucca plants, each with 4 ins metal spikes attached.
I would have thought I could have done more damage with these than with a squirt of H.P sauce!
Before anyone asks, the plants (sold for vivariums) are to put on our small patio, the spikes to hold them in pots of sand.