Planning for old age in Spain

[costapacket]

I think the older generation of Spanish people get looked after by their families because they have stayed around, helped, lived with, or close too their loved ones. They have not upped sticks and moved thousands of miles away from the family unit.

I think it is quite short sighted to cut ties with the UK. I agree if you can possibly afford to keep a bolt hole there it is very wise to do so.

[Paula]

I don't doubt for a moment that some of you in villages in Spain find that people look out for each other. Some does happen on the coast too believe it or not, which is how I come to shop and ferry around a group of older people. But granted it maybe does not happen to the extent that it happens in villages.
Looking out for people is not the same as caring for them in old age. I'd go a fair way to help out people, but I am not a carer in the full sense of the word, and never would want to be. And I imagine thats exactly how it will be in a village, everyone popping in to see if you need any shopping etc, but thats it.
Old age care does require more than a few favours by neighbours or friends, and it that sort of thing that concerns me with the older folk that I know here. A couple of them are starting to hit problems where they suddenly realise that there is nothing on tap, if they need help they shall have to pay for it, and with everything else that is happening financially, that is not a viable option.

[Paula]

Yes Peter and DA I agree with what you are saying. We are living in the "I want it all. without any effort" era.

And added to that we are living in the "if you made the effort and achieved something, there will be no reward whatsoever!" era.

[costapacket]

I don't agree Katy, as we are already being looked after here. Like Peter, we live in a small village where things ARE different from the Costas. We ARE included and cared for like the rest of the village. I know you are not going to have it, Katy, but some lucky people DO get on with life in Spain. On Saturday 27th I'm having a traditional English Christmas tea and have invited 50 friends, all Spanish but 8 people (and they are German and Dutch) as some small recompense for all the kindness, advice, help, friendship, vegetables, cakes, you name it we have had it, this last year. It's impossible to describe what life is like here as you seem to set your face against the possibility of something simple, decent and nice happening to one of us.

Katy, come and visit me. Let me show you something good.

It is one things doing the occasional good turn for some one and taking them a cake or two when they've been under the weather.

Try toileting and caring for someone with dementia 24/7 and see if anyone is willing to do that for you.

[Devils Advocate]

Lavanda, just one point and I do apologise if I'm way off target here but........ when you say 50 friends around for the party do you mean "friends" or "aquaintences" as these 2 words often get misused and mixed up I find.


DA

[Bongtrees]

No Lavanda, not true again ..How would they get that to work anyway DA

DA

I write that one has to fund the care of the ancient relatives unless one is *beep* poor.

You reply stating its not true plus rolling eyes then go on to say how unfair it all is in the UK and that unless one is *beep* poor one either has to pay or lose ones inheritance.

Where is the difference?

[katy]

I agree with Costapacket and Paula. Bringing round a few veg and eggs is not real care. We did live Inland for a while and they did do that, mainly because they were curious or they wanted to tell us who could do what (for money of course). Of course putting on a party will get them round, they are only human...but what relevance has that got to the discussion? you don't know if a friend in need (especially two ancient foreigners)will look like a f/king nuisance to them. Will they be running you to the hospital when you can't drive? Will they come round when one of you has a fall in the middle of the night?

It is not true now that the Spanish take anymore care of their elderly, has been in the news this week that the social service are indunated with requests to provide homes for their eldery relatives...and I aint writing about Marbella!

[Paula]

A Spanish woman I know from UK that moved back to Marbella 4 years ago has had to have her mother from Madrid move in. She has Alzheimers. There was no care place available in Madrid.
Dreadful as they don't have room and they have a 3 yr old daughter, the mother is far worse behaved and far more work than the 3 yr old!

[Bongtrees]

I don't agree Katy, as we are already being looked after here. Like Peter, we live in a small village where things ARE different from the Costas. We ARE included and cared for like the rest of the village.
I know you are not going to have it, Katy, but some lucky people DO get on with life in Spain. On Saturday 27th I'm having a traditional English Christmas tea and have invited 50 friends, all Spanish but 8 people (and they are German and Dutch) as some small recompense for all the kindness, advice, help, friendship, vegetables, cakes, you name it we have had it, this last year. It's impossible to describe what life is like here as you seem to set your face against the possibility of something simple, decent and nice happening to one of us.

Lavanda your use of words and phrases such as ¨being looked after¨ and cared for do not equate with the true meaning of being cared for if one was old and infirm. What you are describing is common or garden neighbourliness and nothing more.

Neighbourliness is practiced everywhere on the planet and not confined to somewhere in the back of beyond in Spain.

[julian]

"Neighbourliness is practiced everywhere on the planet"..Maybe true, but to very varying amounts depending on exactly where you are on the planet.

[Devils Advocate]

I write that one has to fund the care of the ancient relatives unless one is **** poor.

You reply stating its not true plus rolling eyes then go on to say how unfair it all is in the UK and that unless one is **** poor one either has to pay or lose ones inheritance.

Where is the difference?

I don't understand your post with all the ***'s* but just to reiterate, NOBODY has to fund any relatives for rest homes in the UK no matter how much money they have, OK?, it is funded by the person going into the home out of funds they have until the pot dwindles £18000 when the gubment step in .

Now if you are talking about relatives having to fund it via "future inheritance" then you may have a very tenuous point but hopefuly you weren't meaning that

DA

[Bongtrees]

"Neighbourliness is practiced everywhere on the planet"..Maybe true, but to very varying amounts depending on exactly where you are on the planet.

Yes Julian you are quite right and whilst neighbourliness will be practiced to a greater or lesser degree (depending on the type of neighbours of course) anywhere on the planet, a foreign couple moving far from civilisation to a village with no other foreigners will have huge curiosity value........... in any country.

That same couple (assuming both are English) moving to a street of fellow English people might just not fit in because of course the neighbours will know what they are like very quickly.

To suggest that living in one place or another is sooooooo much better than where another person lives just because the neighbours swap stuff is strange and to expand that into saying that one is cared for and expect to be when god forbid one becomes ill or infirm is delusional.

My mother does have alzheimers and I do pay her nursing home fees from her estate. If she lives long enough to exhaust it all then so be it but there is absolutely no way that I could look adequately after her as not only is she doubly incontinent some days she can be a danger to herself and everyone around her.

[pigs-might-fly]

Just make sure you die early, with no moneey in the bank, or assets in your name!

[Paula]

To suggest that living in one place or another is sooooooo much better than where another person lives just because the neighbours swap stuff is strange and to expand that into saying that one is cared for and expect to be when god forbid one becomes ill or infirm is delusional.

Not sure that anyone has actually said they expect to be cared for by neighbours and friends when infirm etc, certainly hope that nobody would be deluded enough to think that.
I think that in general the problem is people don't like to think about the possible negatives of getting older and what that may involve. Personally I think it should be an important factor when planning to move outside of the UK.
No amount of speaking Spanish, integration, friendly caring villages or urbanisations, will provide care. As always it will be down to money.

[peteroldracer]

As always it will be down to money.

Paula, please suggest where we could meet so that I can hand over my crown as chief cynic and general hater of others!

[Lavanda]

"Not sure that anyone has actually said they expect to be cared for by neighbours and friends when infirm etc, certainly hope that nobody would be deluded enough to think that."

Paula, thank goodness at least one person actually READS what others post!!!

Anyway, I'm bored with all this as I seem to have got the whole thrust of the thread wrong. If 'Planning for old age in Spain' comes down to relying on, or expecting, neighbours to 'wipe my bottom' then, no, I've not planned very well. My neighbours here will NOT do that for me. Nor would my neighbours in the UK. Nor, might I add would I ever think of doing that for ANY of my neighbours. I do not consider 'bottom wiping' an extension of friendly neighbourliness. What planet are you people living on???

I have, like you all, completed my watertight EPA two years ago before the government hiked up the fees to over £600. I am very pleased and happy to know that when I'm totally bonkers my bottom wiper will be highly trained, well paid and with strict instructions to include a weekly facial, manicure and pedicure. If any of you thought that I was the sort of person to NOT have an EPA then I'm with Jool and misunderstood - but I'm also pretty incredulous.

[julian]

10 out of 10 Lavanda.

[Paula]

Paula, please suggest where we could meet so that I can hand over my crown as chief cynic and general hater of others!

Peter, I couldn't possibly, you wear that hat so well

Julian, please don't start marking posts, I've a feeling we may end up with a detention lounge next door to the amigos lounge

[julian]

"I've a feeling we may end up with a detention lounge next door to the amigos lounge "..true, and there may be a lot of us in there!

[peteroldracer]

I am often there, handing out exercises to the miscreants like writing 1000 times "should have, not should of; could have, not could of" and "when it is, it is 'it's'; when it it is 'its bits' it is its ".