Agents cut

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MarkF
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Agents cut

Postby MarkF » Tue Jun 23, 2009 4:47 pm

Got a big shock today, clause 10 in my new rental contract stipulates that I must make the 1000eu commission payment to the agent, Allenglobe. I've rented before and have not been asked to do this, surely Allenglobe are the property owners agent, not mine? (They have been spectaularly useless and I have to bypass them in 90% of the negotiations anyway).

I brought it to their attention saying that they may have, perhaps, got puddled mup, but no, they say that it is correct in Spain, I not the owner must make the fee/commission/cut payment to the agent. Is this right?

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Re: Agents cut

Postby lucy locket » Tue Jun 23, 2009 4:52 pm

When we were going to rent our property out there was a couple of agents that took 1 month from us and one month from the renter, double bubble. But usually the property owner pays the commission.
I think they make it up as they go along. :x

They are all horrible....

MarkF
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Re: Agents cut

Postby MarkF » Tue Jun 23, 2009 7:31 pm

Below is what they said,

"Sobre la claúsula décima le comento que en España, concretamente en Asturias, siempre pagan los honorarios de la agencia los inquilinos, no los propietarios, si desea puede informarse en cualquier agencia inmobiliaria de Asturias."

Loosely:- "It's normal, it's always the tenant that pays not the owner, everybody agent will tell me the same."

This cannot be true! :? Why on earth would I pay an agent? Especially one who has proved to be inept, like I said, 90% of the negotiations have been carried out between myself and the owner due to the agents inability to foward information to either of us. The owner surely pays the agent, for advertising and bringing in my interest, yes?

K chameleon
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Re: Agents cut

Postby K chameleon » Tue Jun 23, 2009 11:45 pm

If I understand you correctly, this is a new contract, but with the same property/owners.
As you've already said you've dealt directly with the owners previously, I don't see why the agent should be included any more.
You can get rental contracts from the Tobaconists, for a few euros.

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Re: Agents cut

Postby Lavanda » Wed Jun 24, 2009 6:04 am

I've rented out property in the UK through an agent and they always take one month from me, the owner, and one from the renter. The reason behind this is that I get a decent person in my property that has been thoroughly checked out and the renter gets a decent property and landlady that also has been checked out. It comes under a 'duty of care' clause for both parties who both pay. Perhaps Spain is catching up with the U.K. on this one?

MarkF
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Re: Agents cut

Postby MarkF » Wed Jun 24, 2009 7:54 am

KC, no, this a new place, I haven't dealt with the owners previously. The agnet was so useless that I obtained the owners home number and have dealt with them direct. they, however, have a contract with the agents.

Lavanda, that is interesting and I can see your point. But...the agents have done zero for me and have made no checks. If they are wanting to earn 1000eu (500 from owner and renter) for doing nothing other than posting one pathetic pic on the internet then the deal will not go ahead, I will not pay them for doing nothing for me.

PS. The house is lovely but I only knew that on arrival as Allenglobe took one pic, from the attic bedroom, looking at the ceiling and velux window :lol:

McT
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Re: Agents cut

Postby McT » Wed Jun 24, 2009 7:55 am

Unfortunately, it does appear to be the norm in Spain. We are in our second rental property, and both times we had to pay the agent a month's rent. It's the same with property sales. Although it may appear that the vendor is paying the agent, they don't - it's the buyer who pays. The vendor tells the agent that he wants X€ for his house and the agent advertises it for (X + Y%)€. The buyer is paying Y% on top of the vendor's price.

However, in the current market, where there is a glut of rental properties, you may be able to negotiate. Remind the owner that there are hundreds of properties available and that you'll look elsewhere unless he pays some or all of the agent's commission.

McT

MarkF
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Re: Agents cut

Postby MarkF » Wed Jun 24, 2009 8:25 am

McT, thank you, I am going to calm down and tell the owner that I happy to pay the 500 if he reduces the rent by 41.66 a month :)

Thing is, suitable properties (4 beds, 2 baths, near schools/shops etc ) are very scarce up here. It's actually very difficult to find a house as opposed to an apartment.

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Re: Agents cut

Postby julian » Wed Jun 24, 2009 8:29 am

if it is an introductory comision..for putting the renter and buyer together then the agent looks to have done his job....really depens on what the original agreement was

McT
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Re: Agents cut

Postby McT » Wed Jun 24, 2009 10:11 am

MarkF wrote:The house is lovely but I only knew that on arrival as Allenglobe took one pic, from the attic bedroom, looking at the ceiling and velux window :lol:
This is typical of Spanish agents. None of them seem to have a camera with a wide angle lens, with the result that all you see of the inside of the house is the furniture. There will never be a photo of the outside of the house, because then you might identify it (if you are familiar with the area) and go directly to the owner. For the same reason agents never put the address on the website.

There will often be a picture of the pool if there is one and I became expert at identifying houses by the shape and orientation of their pools, using Google Earth.

McT

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Re: Agents cut

Postby McT » Wed Jun 24, 2009 10:16 am

MarkF wrote:I am going to calm down and tell the owner that I happy to pay the 500 if he reduces the rent by 41.66 a month
Surely it's an 11 month contract? You need the rent reduced by 45.45€ :wink:

McT

MarkF
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Re: Agents cut

Postby MarkF » Wed Jun 24, 2009 11:38 am

McT wrote:Surely it's an 11 month contract? You need the rent reduced by 45.45€ :wink:
McT
Nope, it's 12 months, I expected a 11 month contract to be sent to me, another strange thing. :?
McT wrote:
MarkF wrote:The house is lovely but I only knew that on arrival as Allenglobe took one pic, from the attic bedroom, looking at the ceiling and velux window :lol:
This is typical of Spanish agents. None of them seem to have a camera with a wide angle lens, with the result that all you see of the inside of the house is the furniture. There will never be a photo of the outside of the house, because then you might identify it (if you are familiar with the area) and go directly to the owner. For the same reason agents never put the address on the website.

There will often be a picture of the pool if there is one and I became expert at identifying houses by the shape and orientation of their pools, using Google Earth.

McT
All so very true. A pic of a velux window though would flummox the best google earther. :lol: The non-giving out of addresses would be be fine if they actually did their job. I have made offers to desperate owners that they have never received, the agents just don't pass them on.

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Re: Agents cut

Postby Scot » Wed Jun 24, 2009 2:10 pm

MarkF did the agent not arrange a viewing of the property, perhaps meet you there? It is usual to pay one months commission to the agent for the rental here. We have just heard we passed the tenant reference check for the UK and been accepted for a rental property - whoopee!!!!!!!!! (Was getting desperate - starting to look at caravan sites :( ).

MarkF
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Re: Agents cut

Postby MarkF » Wed Jun 24, 2009 2:49 pm

No Scot, the agent were incapable of arranging a viewing, I don''t think they are capable of tying their shoelaces, it's a long story........

I won't pay them anything, not one euro, I'd rather lose the house. A 1000 euros for being useless, no way! :evil:

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toyotadesigner
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Re: Agents cut

Postby toyotadesigner » Wed Jun 24, 2009 4:12 pm

Rule # 1: the owner pays the agent
Rule # 2: if the agent wants to screw you, quit. Or at least mention you'll quit.
Rule # 3: agents who want to cash in twice are useless in society.
Rule # 4: the times are rough 'n tough. The owners can be lucky if they can rent their wrecks
Rule # 5: negotiate
Rule # 6: if you think you'll be ripped off purposely, move to another location, far away from the coast.

We didn't pay any commission at all. Just one month deposit. The owner is happy that he could rent his property after he tried to sell it for more than one and a half year. He even let us suggest the monthly rent, so we could manage to get it for less than 50% of what he wanted before. If there is any problem with the house, I just send him a mail and the next day the service rings at the front door - on the expense of the owner of course.

More than 80% of the agents had to close their biz during the last 12 months here in the Granada area. IMHO all those idiots who didn't realize the market change.

The times for overcharging belong to the past. Don't let yourself be fooled by some lousy agents.

Maybe a dumb question: why didn't you contact the owner? He'll be scared to death if you'll inform him you are going to leave because of the lousy agent. Don't forget: most owners have financed a home at 100% or have a huge loan on an 'old' house to get the 'new' one, and the banks are rude when it comes to new negotiations, so most owners really do have a keen interest in keeping their tenants as long as possible to keep the bank quiet.
We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them.

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MarkF
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Re: Agents cut

Postby MarkF » Wed Jun 24, 2009 7:18 pm

Toyotadesigner, Thank you. I have got on well with the owner and right now, I don't 100% know if he knows that I am being asked for the fee. Also I don't know what his contract is with the agent. I will play hardball with the agent first and then talk to the owner.

You are right, I don't care what is a "normal" fee or a "normal" procedure, times have changed and these agents better move with the times or close. :evil: I might have agreed (might :D ) to a fee but to ask for 500 eu for doing little for me? And doing that very badly?

Maintenance, they want me to agree to "small repairs"! Why should I maintain somebody else's house? :? IMO it is my job to leave it as I found it, any damage caused by my family to be paid for by me but nothing else.

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toyotadesigner
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Re: Agents cut

Postby toyotadesigner » Wed Jun 24, 2009 8:47 pm

Mark, I've talked to my lawyer. A freebie for you :mrgreen:

If the first contract you've signed didn't mention anything about a new commission if the contract will be renewed, the agent can't charge for his 'service'.

The house is still rented to you. Usually a contract extends itself for one year. The tell tale story with the 11 month contract is a relict from history. Unless you've signed a contract that explicitly states that it will be terminated automatically after a period of X months, it is still a valid contract according to the Spanish laws.

I'm sorry for you, really. And I thought we've been the only ones who have been screwed by an agent and the owner (worst case scenario btw).

Good luck for you, stretch your back, and remember that even in Spain 'extranjeros' have the same rights and the same laws apply.
We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them.

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MarkF
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Re: Agents cut

Postby MarkF » Wed Jun 24, 2009 10:55 pm

Thanks again TD :)

To clarify,

This is a new contract.
I have not rented from this owner before.
I have never dealt with Allenglobe (or any agent) before, always with the owner.


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