Comments and queries re FAQ for Non-resident income tax

[DesWalker]

Okay, I'm just about there. I've printed out the completed form and just want to confirm a couple of final points.

1. In each of the three signature boxes am I right to put the date on top with my signature beneath and no printed handwritten name anywhere ?

2. I appreciate that it is only the form with the blue F that requires my NIE to be written by hand but to be sure I intend to write it on all three forms. This won't cause anyone to blow a gasket will it ?

3. Do I just write these NIEs at the top of the page in the white stripe above where the orange colour starts or at the bottom below my signature or anywhere in particular ?

Sorry for such mind numbingly childish questions (I can't believe I'm asking them to be honest - I'm really not a moron) but I'm doing my utmost to get it as correct as possible whilst over here in the UK in order to avoid any mishaps at the bank when I go in to pay. I won't have my laptop with me when I'm over there so the last thing I want is to be told by some jobsworth that I need to change something in the form and print the thing out again for some ridiculous reason.

But once I've got it right the first time I'm the sort of sad person who makes notes so as not to forget so you won't have me bugging you again (he says )

Des

[Enrique]

Hi DesWalker,
No problem with the questions.....that's what we are here for........

1) Correct

2) Only need to write your NIE on the Form that doesn't have the Printed one on.

3) I put mine in top left, forgot one year and all was well.............

[Beachcomber]

The bank will only keep the form with the blue F on it. The other two copies will (should) be given back to you but make sure that they are properly validated with the string of computer generated digits and not just stamped.

[DesWalker]

Many thanks. All done

Any tips on what I should do if they attempt to just stamp the two forms that I keep rather than do a proper validation with a string of computer generated digits and a stamp ? My bank is in a tourist area so I'm hoping they aren't confused by all this (let's face it they didn't ought to be ) but you never know.

Des

[Beachcomber]

If you insist they should do it. If not ask to speak to the manager.

One local bank said they had been told not to do it to save ink! The banks are paid by AEAT for every tax return that they process so they are obliged to do it properly.

[cattod]

Hi,

Ran a search and could not find this discussed. To make things murkier, it says "the rate of 1,1% of the valor catastral applies if the property has been revised since 1994.". I don't think the wording is accurate and here is why. My property was built in 2002 so the valor catastral is clearly created post 1994. However, that is not what matters because what they really mean is how old is the methodology used to calculate said value.
If you look at the IBI gravamen for your location you will find something like below. The year of the revision catastral determines the 1.1 vs 2 %. I know it shows on the IBI but may be easily overlooked and logic used instead: "How could my 2002 property have been revised in 1990?"
Año Rev. Catastral T. Urbana % T. Rustica % Carat. Esp. %
2014 1990 0.6 -9.09% 0.3 0.00% 0.6 0.00%
2013 1990 0.66 10.00% 0.3 0.00% 0.6 0.00%
2012 1990 0.6 0.00% 0.3 0.00% 0.6 0.00%
2011 1990 0.6 0.00% 0.3 0.00% 0.6 0.00%

Go to any city here http://www.foro-ciudad.com/malaga/marbe ... entos.html, click on the Documentos tab and then on the IBI link to check.

As mentioned regarding other translation mistakes this could cause a bit of trouble.
The original Spanish is: "Rev. Catastral: Año de entrada en vigor de valores catastrales".

[Beachcomber]

It is not the revision of your individual property that counts it is that of the municipality generally.

If it does not appear on your IBI receipt you can check here directly from the horse's mouth rather than rely on a third party source:

http://juntadeandalucia.es/boja/2014/13 ... 051700.pdf

Marbella was most recently revised in 2012 so 1,1% of the valor catastral applies.

[cattod]

Being 8 time zones away and getting no reply from my Sabadell "personal bank agent" I am very interested in the statement below and what it implies.
"The form is transmitted to AEAT when it is generated and validated when payment is made at the bank."
So, having successfully completed 210 pdf generation is akin to filing and potentially acceptable in the 21st century even in Spain. I am aware of the digital certificate, don't have one.
The pdf contains the account number of the Public Treasury so I can make the payment myself on line. Would that satisfy the Tax Agency overall or I still failed to file?

Alternatively, on advoco.es it says about 210:
"How does the tax get paid?

We include your Spanish bank account details on the tax return so the authorities can deduct the payment automatically. This is done at the end of the year. On the 31st December the tax office will debit the account you have nominated."

Is that true?
Is that the result of the paper form being filed or will it happen regardless?
In your experience the bank makes no payment when the form is filed?
Perhaps everything falls into place because the instructions say once you give the form to the bank there is no need to send anything to the Tax Agency.


Thank you!

[Enrique]

Hi cattod,
Welcome to The Forum.............

Being eight Time Zones away is a red herring........I'm normally one or in the same Zone.........

Was having a 10 month saga with Sabadell until doing the below............sorted in less than a week.....

To get action from Sabadell............if you have Facebook ,search for their page and put your request/question there..........got instant ( well 2 minutes ) response at the weekend even...........

To get email response....... use the contact on their head office web site .......include your Branch number

https://www.grupbancsabadell.com/en/XTD ... /CONTACTAR

As for the other part of your question......Beachcomber will have some ideas...........

[cattod]

Gracias Enrique!
We have pelicans and seagulls here in Calgary, believe it or not, but no red herrings of any kind.
Based on a very long term vision we also have a naval base http://www.calgaryplus.ca/calgary/venues/hmcs-tecumseh

More digging on the topic: http://spainaccountants.com/blog/?p=6
If anyone knows the paragraph below not being true please let me know. Either way I think I will go on with the experiment. I owe 50 euros and even with a late fine I will be saving money by not using a third party to do this.
However nowadays a much more simple option is available, which is to submit the return online along with the order for the tax to be debited directly to your Spanish bank account (know as domiciliacion). The tax payment will be effected on 31st December.

[Enrique]

Some Members have reported they paid through their Bank, one was going to checkout Sabadell but has not come back with any info yet..............

I've not seen the option with my bank so have the excuse to come over every year to pay my dues.........

[Beachcomber]

I think that article is referring to submission with a digital signature.

You may be able to do it with a PIN24 but I haven't investigated that possibility.

The only other way is with a Número de Referencia Completo from your bank. Just filling in the bank account number on the form and then generating a PDF will not complete the payment procedure.

[cattod]

Could be, could be, but easy to test I guess. Can anyone who filed and paid using a digital certificate say whether the payment was effected immediately or taken on Dec 31st?

[BrinleyDavies]

I know that where the property is owned jointly by a husband and wife that both need to submit a return.

However, would there any problem in practice if only one of them submits the form for the full amount of the tax?

[Enrique]

Hi BrinleyDavies,
I've done that in the past before it can out on A.com that you should submit two Forms if joint owners, had no come back from AEAT.

I'm guessing that your wife isn't registered with AEAT from your post ....

[Emma-Louise]

Hi,

I completed the form months and months ago.....since then our account number has changed (our local branch closed so we were given a new branch and a new account number)...I now don't know what to do...

I can't even remember how I completed the form only in the first place!

If someone could give me the link to the Spanish form 210 for non-residents can I just start again?

Or do I need to cancel this one somehow first?

Thanks

[cattod]

Beachcomber, you were correct. Spain Accountants have acknowledged that their article was in fact about online with digital certificate.

[Enrique]

Hi Emma-Louise,

" completed the form months and months ago.....since then our account number has changed (our local branch closed so we were given a new branch and a new account number)...I now don't know what to do..."

"Or do I need to cancel this one somehow first?"...................you can generate as may as you like the only one that counts is the one you take to a Bank that gets scanned and you part with the cash.

...............so you didn't pay it.............I don't follow where you are at.............

See FAQ's for link to Form 210 ...............why not use the English version..............

http://andalucia.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=27897

One way is Fill in Form, validated , print ,take the three sheets to a Bank , they scan in barcode you pay in cash, no mention of Bank account details.

[nevillewillmott]

Could be, could be, but easy to test I guess. Can anyone who filed and paid using a digital certificate say whether the payment was effected immediately or taken on Dec 31st?

Hi

I have attempted to pay Impuestos Sobre la Renta No Residentes for 2013 using a digital certificate. My case turned out to be somewhat complicated but here goes:-

Filling in the form online using Modelo 210 generated using a digital certificate was straightforward with the assistance of Beachcomber and others. The entries are now stored in the virtual records of Agencia Tributaria where they can be viewed using your digital certificate. Further perusal of Agencia Tributaria website (digital certificate needed) confirms that payment falls due on December 31st 2013. Certainly, my Sabadell account has not been debited even though the entries are now 3 weeks old.

Problem(s) arose when I tried to set up a standing order online, which I attribute to a mismatch between my types of identification - NIE (used in Modelo 210) and passport number (used by my bank). Still have not sorted this but I have a year to do it

Anyway, I decided to fill in Modelo 210 generated WITHOUT the use of a digital certificate. As has been described elsewhere in this forum, you take hard copies of the appropriate forms generated to a bank branch in Spain. This worked fine and the payment is now on record at Agencia Tributaria website

So far so good. But what about the payments on record that were generated by filling in Modelo 210 using a digital certificate that fall due on December 31st 2013? Another advantage of a digital certificate is that you can correspond With Agencia Tributaria. I have requested that these pending payments be cancelled. There is a record of my submission but no reply as yet

Rather lengthy I am afraid but to answer your basic question -I am convinced that payment using a digital certificate is not immediate but falls due at the end of the tax year

Que tengas suerte

[cattod]

Well, I have to give up and accept that I cannot understand why taking money from tax payers has to be so difficult in Spain. There is one thing to secure an account with AEAT but filing and paying should be simply tied to your NIE like other countries do.
With Sabadell, buried under See all options -> Other Services -> Taxes and social insurances you can find this form: https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=D ... 745%217135. However, it seems to actually talk to AEAT because when I tried to pay it came back with the message incorrect amount which is likely the result of them having no knowledge of my owing anything.
In the Operational section there is another link called simply Liquidation that opens this form: https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=D ... 745%217136. This one allows you to proceed and I went as far as the confirmation code and I have no reason to believe it will not produce the NRC (Complete Reference Number) as promised but unfortunately without the other important part, filing the return, I don't think it would help me much so I did not pay.
I found a company in Orihuela who will do the 210 for 40 euros and for 30 if you follow them on Twitter so guess who has a brand new Twitter account . I understand that the forum rules allow posting the name if someone requests it.
Next year I will get a digital certificate.
Accounting is something special altogether. I think inside the system your due amount is zero and you will be fine but you might see something funny in your bank account. For example, after I paid in cash my insurance, the MAPFRE system still debited the amount on the due date but immediately issued a refund.