Taking the plunge!

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Cupcake
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Taking the plunge!

Postby Cupcake » Thu Jul 01, 2021 3:25 pm

To those of you who’ve moved to Spain, what was the catalyst for making the decision to move, and was it a good one?

We’ve a house in Seville that we’ve had for 15 years or so, we visit around 4 times per year and each time it’s more difficult to leave. We’d like to spend more time there as we love it, but jobs will not allow.

I’m trying to weigh up the benefits of moving full time to Spain against giving up a well paid job in the UK and a nice home (to be able to retire in Spain we’d need to sell our uk home, or at least swap our house for a flat).

I’m not a huge risk taker hence the indecision, but I don’t want life to pass me by either!

All advice and experiences welcome!

Best wishes,
Cupcake

casita-bonita
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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby casita-bonita » Thu Jul 01, 2021 4:36 pm

For us, I retired and we moved over here full time at 53. The decision was made when we figured out that we had enough reserves to live comfortably in Spain. Another year or 10 wouldn't make a significant difference in our lifestyle, on the contrary we wanted the freedom to travel and see the world while we still had the energy and hopefully lifespan to do it.

Only you can decide how much is enough to support the lifestyle you want.

Now been here 12 years and not regretted pacing up work for 1 second.
Regards

Bob

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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby Cupcake » Thu Jul 01, 2021 5:05 pm

Thanks Bob, I guess that’s where we are (sort of). The big thing for us is selling our house here and replacing it with a very small flat in the UK just to stay in the market, in 10 years time we may not need to do that, but my argument is that I could be dead by then (I’m 50)!!

First world problems I know, but it’s so hard, when I’m in Spain I think oh let’s do it! Then I get home and the thought of selling the house and jacking in the job I’ve had for 20 years seems unnerving. I need more courage and sense of abandon I think!

casita-bonita
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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby casita-bonita » Thu Jul 01, 2021 5:23 pm

It is a big decision, life changing in fact. So you need to be sure.

As we didn't need the money at the time we kept our house in the uk and rent it out. This gives us (normally) some income. But on the flip side, and we didn't realise this, we will have a huge capital gains tax bill from the Spanish govt should we sell it. So we're kind of stuck with it now. Although over the years we have made way more in rental than we would have made sticking the proceeds from sale in a bank. And of course over 12 years the value of the place has increased significantly.. Whether we will ever sell it and swallow the tax bill is at this time doubtful, but who knows what the future holds.

If you're going to downsize do it before you become tax resident in Spain. The UK tax bill will be WAY less, due to allowences. This is assuming of course you have made a decent profit on it. If you haven't the point is pretty much moot.
Regards

Bob

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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby katy » Thu Jul 01, 2021 6:11 pm

I would recommend a bolt hole even though we didn’t. Early retirement is ok if you are a Teacher, Civil Servant etc. We retired early, Husband employed someone to run business so we still had income. I think only you can decide although you will be aware of all the cliches like “only one life to live etc but you can take it 2 ways, why b**ger it up. :mrgreen:

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Wicksey
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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby Wicksey » Thu Jul 01, 2021 6:28 pm

We bought our first house here in the mid 1990s when they were much cheaper than homes in the UK. We never intended moving here fulltime, and planned to only spend the winters here once we'd taken early retirement. However, after only 4 years of coming here for holidays, we decided to move here permanently aged 42. We weren't very happy at work and the chance to 'retire' was too much to resist. We used some of the equity when we sold our modest UK home to buy 2 small flats to rent to give us an income before we moved here. It was cheap to live in our tiny campo house so we knew we could manage on a small income.

Over the years we have moved to France and then back here again, but we have never regretted doing what we did. We still have a rental property in the UK which we will sell once we get our state pensions (we didn't work for long enough to get full pensions but it will be equal to our rental income). We get civil service pensions in the meantime. We realise we shall have a huge CGT bill but there's little we can do to avoid that. I think we'll just have to suffer that. We plan to move to Lanzarote one day, in which case we'll need the money from both our houses in order to afford anything decent over there.

It depends on what you'd like to do as to whether you want to come and go between here and the UK or move out here permanently. I know a lot of people miss family in the UK which we don't really have, and their social life or theatre/live music etc if that's something that is a big part of their life. I know of many that have moved back to the UK for various reasons, but we have been away for 21 years now and I don't see it as home to me anymore. If you have doubts, then make sure you keep a UK base.

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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby elusive » Thu Jul 01, 2021 7:36 pm

Be aware of possible tax issues like capital gains if selling your uk house in the same year you become a spanish tax resident. Also look into the visa you will need.presuming money wont be an issue if you are thinking of retiring now

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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby Cupcake » Thu Jul 01, 2021 7:51 pm

Thanks for all your replies and insights, really useful. I think the best thing is for us is possibly not to not see it as a permanent move, maybe keep both houses for a couple of years, try it out and see how we go….think I’m trying too hard to make a final decision when all said and done I can just give it a try and see what happens!

elusive
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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby elusive » Thu Jul 01, 2021 8:15 pm

Remember the 90/180 rule. Which makes it harder but will still give you an idea. Theres alot more hassle in coming due to brexit but the best thing is to do as much research as possible. Many on here have great knowlege and certainly made my move pain free.

Living here isnt that much difference. It sounds daft but you still have the drudgery of shopping, cleaning etc etc. The day to day things arent much difference. As others have said the main issue for many is family/friends that draw people back. So alot can depend on how close you are to family. When grandkids etc come along.

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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby Cupcake » Thu Jul 01, 2021 8:35 pm

We’re child free so no immediate family to worry about, friends, I have some already in Seville, but obviously will miss some UK ones but not enough to stop me going! I’m not huge on socializing tbh.

The thing I worry about is missing the mental workout I get from my job, and mixing with all ages through my job. But my job can be incredibly stressful and I wouldn’t miss that at all or the office politics!

The red tape is frustrating, but eventually it would get sorted, so not overly concerned about that.

My main concern is leaving behind a lifestyle that if I wanted it back, I don’t think I could get back. But I could gain so much in other ways.....COVID isn’t helping either or Brexit!

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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Thu Jul 01, 2021 9:47 pm

My advice...is rent somewhere in Spain and see how it goes. Don't buy straight away. Time it right tax wise and you can sell up later in the UK without any CGT to pay. Although retaining the UK property and having rental income from the UK is very tax efficient in Spain. Depending on how long you want to visit the UK every year it may be cheaper and a lost less hassle to just get and Air BnB when you return for visits. It is surprising how much it costs to maintain a house especially when it is not used much.

I retired in all but name when I was 33 and kind of did it step by step. I wanted out of my old life but wasn't sure if I could slow down. So I did it bit by bit and now I don't know how I found time for work. I found other outlets to fill the mental workout that work gives. Another advice I would give is don't move to the Campo. In town you see and talk to so many more people and that fills the void of not working.

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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby Cupcake » Thu Jul 01, 2021 10:42 pm

Thanks Paddy, house not a problem as we’ve owned one in Seville for 15 years, but only visited as a holiday home. After 15 years of visiting we’re pretty sure of the area...

My Spanish is pretty appalling so learning that will keep me mentally agile for a while I think!

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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby pepe jose » Fri Jul 02, 2021 8:07 am

I would take a 3 month break from work and live in Spain totally legal for the 90 days and see how you feel after that. I am sure they would let you do that as you have worked there years

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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby Cupcake » Fri Jul 02, 2021 8:44 am

I’d love to do that Pepe, but I’m a contractor so unfortunately if I take three months out I couldn’t go back (and yes I know 20 years as a contractor!).

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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby elusive » Fri Jul 02, 2021 8:55 am

Cupcake wrote: Thu Jul 01, 2021 8:35 pm We’re child free so no immediate family to worry about, friends, I have some already in Seville, but obviously will miss some UK ones but not enough to stop me going! I’m not huge on socializing tbh.

The thing I worry about is missing the mental workout I get from my job, and mixing with all ages through my job. But my job can be incredibly stressful and I wouldn’t miss that at all or the office politics!

The red tape is frustrating, but eventually it would get sorted, so not overly concerned about that.

My main concern is leaving behind a lifestyle that if I wanted it back, I don’t think I could get back. But I could gain so much in other ways.....COVID isn’t helping either or Brexit!
I guess one option is to meet in the middle. Retire but further down the line when you feel like you want to. If you are already thinking about what if i miss work then maybe thats your answer and you arent ready to pack it all in right now

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Wicksey
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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby Wicksey » Fri Jul 02, 2021 9:19 am

I think for us, it was the chance to give up work that was the attraction to coming here full time. Like us, you already have your house here and you have a chance to rent out the UK one whilst you give it a go here. My OH took a month off work and stayed here before we moved, and he loved it. There was a period of adjustment, probably at least 6 months, as we had to get used to a new routine in a new country. It did feel weird to start with I must admit, but I have never looked back, never regretted our move.

As I said, I have seen many return to the UK for various reasons, often family ones, or when a partner died the remaining one has returned. However, these were people I never felt were fully at home here in the first place. Good luck with whatever you choose to do.

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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby chrissiehope » Fri Jul 02, 2021 1:44 pm

When we bought our house, it was always with the intention of retiring there. However, Fate has a nasty habit of chucking spanners, & I was (wrongly !) diagnosed with terminal cancer, which rather made us suspend the original plan.
Then hubby was diagnosed with a terminal lung condition - this time it was, & less than 9 years of Spanish ownership, he had died :-( & I was the one on my own. Sadly, I couldn't afford to move on my own, & with various other legal situations involved, it was decided to sell. I only visited it once after that - I found it too painful.
Sorry to be a wet blanket, just wanted to point out that you never know what's around the corner ;-)
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Wicksey
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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby Wicksey » Fri Jul 02, 2021 2:16 pm

That's a sad story Chrissiehope. I know plans can be upset by unexpected events. A couple agreed to buy a little holiday home nearby with the intention of moving in full time, but just as they came to complete the purchase the crash happened and the euro plummeted meaning they had to borrow extra money. Then his pension was far less than expected and they couldn't afford to live here full time. They had only just bought the place but had to immediately put it back on the market.

Whatever happens now, we do not want to go back to the UK and I would stay here on my own if anything happened to my OH. However, I've been away from the UK 21 years, a big proportion of my adult life, and the UK simply is not home anymore and I have few ties there. I don't think people know how they will manage living abroad until they try it, and I think that the majority of people we have known over the years have returned to the UK. But if you don't try it out, you don't know.

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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Fri Jul 02, 2021 6:17 pm

Cupcake wrote: Thu Jul 01, 2021 10:42 pm Thanks Paddy, house not a problem as we’ve owned one in Seville for 15 years, but only visited as a holiday home. After 15 years of visiting we’re pretty sure of the area...

My Spanish is pretty appalling so learning that will keep me mentally agile for a while I think!
What I mean is the place you want to holiday in and the place you want to live my be very different. When I was working full time my holidays were in the middle of nowhere and talking to nobody. I even went as far as to one chooose a place thathad no phone signal.

But now I don't work full time I there is no way I would survive out of a town. I would go stir ccrazy with little human interaction and my OH may kill me before that happens. Also to learn Spanish forget about classes etc., they will help at the beginning but you need to speak to people and interact with native Spanish speakers. You won't do that if you are living in the campo.

Aslo don't join any expat clubs or do anything that attracts English speaking people....otherwise you will never learn to speak Spanish. You need to force yourself to interact with natives etc

So just keep in mind that your present house may be great for holidays but not for living in permanently and not for adjusting to a new permanent life in Spain

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Wicksey
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Re: Taking the plunge!

Postby Wicksey » Fri Jul 02, 2021 7:06 pm

Paddy you live in Madrid where things may be different to some areas of Andalucia. Our campo Spanish neighbours speak an unintelligible version of Andaluz that I will never ever pick up. When I go to Madrid or other parts of Spain such as Galicia, I have conversed perfectly well with the locals. Not only do I understand them, but they understand my Spanish too, which the local old boys don't.

I'm afraid I am guilty of joining in with expat activities (often a mixed bunch of internationals) in order to pursue my interests. Not many Spanish do Scottish dancing for example. I would say do what you want to do and try to learn Spanish to be able to mix with the locals, but each to their own. I never go to English bars, that's not my thing, but there aren't a lot of local Spanish groups that grab my interest. It was the same where we lived in France, very rural with just farmers as neighbours. They were friendly and we used to have conversations with them when they invited us in when we went to their farm to buy eggs, but we really had very little in common.


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