fences around swimming pools

[Beachdragon]

does anyone know if it is legal yet for property owners to have to fence their swimming pools off? as most of you now know we have 6 children, 2 toddling soon and i am extremely worried about pools. we want to rent a house with a pool and need to know if we have to budget to fence the pool off at our own cost or if the owners legally have to do it? any info much appreciated and thanks to everyone on the forum who has answered our varied (and many!) questions.

[Solysombra]

I have to make the comment, if you're so worried of the dangers a pool might pose to young children wouldn't it be a wee bit smarter to rent a property without one, this, to me would seem the logical answer, further to this how many landlords do you think there are in Andalucia who are prepared to rent you a multibedroomed property and fence off the pool for you for 6-700€ per month, finally, I really don't wish to be critical of your parenting skills but don't you think the safety and well being of your children is your responsibility and not the landlords?

[Beachdragon]

i have more than just 2 children so I have to consider ALL my children's needs not just the toddlers and the older ones would dearly love a pool. i never once said i expected the landlord to pay for the pool to be fenced off, i asked if we would need to pay for it ourselves which we are more than prepared to do as our children's safety is worth every penny. in france they were trying to bring a law in to make all property owners fence their pools off. i merely asked if anyone knew if this had come into force.

we are considering ALL our childrens feelings and are trying to do our best to make sure they are all happy. we wouldn't be very responsible parents if we didn't have all the facts before we moved, and it may well be that we dont rent a property with a pool. we also have up to 1,000 euro to spend per month not 600, please get your facts right before you post offensive comments about my parenting abilities on this site.

I'm amazed at your rudeness to somone you dont know and have never met. i have never spoken to anyone on this site with anything other than politeness and courtesy, perhaps if you cant do the same, you shouldn't use it.

[katy]

WellI think sol y sombra pitched it about right, if its so worrying don't get a property with a pool.

[Solysombra]

Perhaps others here are not so critical or forward as I.
perhaps we should look at this from another angle.
If you were lucky enough to rent a property with a fenced off pool how can you be so sure that one of your other children, or indeed some interloper would not leave the gate open exposing your children to harm, as I said in my previous posting the wellbeing of your children is not the responsibility of others or do you disagree with that also, my posting was not intended to be offensive but practical

[Beachdragon]

yes solysombra we certainly agree that somone could leave a gate open even if the pool was fenced off, this is a valid comment and has made us think that the gate would have to be padlocked. we never let our youngest children in the garden on their own anyway but you only have to look away for a second and they are gone as all parents know.

we dont even leave the paddling pool with a few inches of water in, accidents so easily happen. rest assured we will be taking every precaution and as you say we may not be lucky enough to get a villa with pool for our paltry money anyway.

[julian]

in france it is now law to have a fence, or an alarm that goes off if anything touches the water surface. here I think only the community pools over a certain size need the fencing.
I hope this information is more useful than the previous posts, you sound very responsible and sensible to me, I hope you find what you are looking for and all the family can enjoy the pool.

[Beachdragon]

thanks for those kind words julian, it is hurtful when people make unkind comments, i asked because last time we were in france they were trying to bring the law in about fencing pools, obviously this law has now come into force.

my children are such mixed ages from 13 years down to 6 weeks and one of the reasons for relocating is we all want to enjoy an outdoor life, our children are really sporty and we would rather they were outside having fun and swimming than sat infront of the telly!

thanks again for the info on the law and for making my hurt feelings feel a little better!

[silver]

Beachdragon .. forget about a pool (the worry, the work, the running costs)..with 6 kids you have enough work on your hands...there are public swimming pools...municipal swimming pools are run by the town hall..most towns have one but not all are indoor/all year round...Then you have gyms and/or fitness centers..a lot have pools ...you become a member (around 30€/month) and can use the pool and facilities when you please.. there is also the sea and some lakes to swim in.

does anyone know if it is legal yet for property owners to have to fence their swimming pools off?

private pools (and shared community pools under 20 properties) have no rules yet.. if you are lucky enough to find a roomy house with a pool for under 1000€ then you would have to fence yourself.

[Beachdragon]

thanks silver, your points are valid and thanks for taking the time to reply. we have lots to think about!

[claire4james]

Beachdragon .. forget about a pool (the worry, the work, the running costs)..with 6 kids you have enough work on your hands...there are public swimming pools...municipal swimming pools are run by the town hall..most towns have one but not all are indoor/all year round...Then you have gyms and/or fitness centers..a lot have pools ...you become a member (around 30€/month) and can use the pool and facilities when you please.. there is also the sea and some lakes to swim in.

does anyone know if it is legal yet for property owners to have to fence their swimming pools off?

private pools (and shared community pools under 20 properties) have no rules yet.. if you are lucky enough to find a roomy house with a pool for under 1000€ then you would have to fence yourself.

I have 2 kids 5 & 6 (both can now swim, 1 couldn't when we moved into the new villa with a pool)....I have rented a property with a communal pool and now am in a villa with a private pool....the private pool will make your life easier.....(the work and the running costs will be met by the landlord (if you negotiate properly and are paying reasonable rent)

In our old place, 1 would want to swim when the other didn't or both would want to swim when it wasn't practical for us to go to the communal pool area, let alone think about going to a public pool!!!

Also, I knew that if the one that couldn't swim fell in, the other was there to alert me, and although he couldn't swim, when he fell in (as was bound to happen!!!!) he was able to kick and grab the side (think this is something most kids can do if they have to, although maybe not the 6 week old one!

I would strongly advise going for a pool, KNOWING that you have to stay alert and be sensible (which you clearly are) and like I say the "added agg" of staying alert is far less than "mum i wanna go swimming" when its not feasable!

Soly....your comment about someone leaving the gate open etc is (I believe) going a little silly with the precautions and risks (one of her other children could leave a carving knife on the kitchen floor that the little one may get......THATS IT:...think you should rent a bouncy castle with no cutlery, things would be much safer

For Soly & Katy.....

Parents (and people in general) do worry (about anything & everything) but it's usually because of what their minds tell them COULD happen (which is of course unknown right now).....And if your advice to anyone worried about something is "dont do it" then I pity anyone coming to you for advice....

[Beachdragon]

FINALLY somone who understands what i was trying to say! there are dangers for kids EVERYWHERE as you say, i wont even let my daughter wear a necklace in bed incase it strangles her (shes 6) but you can go over the top and make yourself a gibberring jelly like mess.

the logisitics of us getting to a public pool are very hard. where do you put a 6 week old baby while everyone else is swimming? if pool is outside how do you protect them from direct sunlight? in your own garden you can make sure you have everything set up to accomodate a baby. you have the same problem getting to the sea or swimming in lakes (not to mention the various nasty bugs you can catch from swimming in dirty water).

we have talked and decided providing the pool is fenced (AT OUR COST) and padlocked (the kids then have to ask if they want to go in it) it should be perfectly safe. we think the positives of having a pool far outweigh the negatives and we wouldnt let even our older children go into the pool without one of us supervising so if we are to busy, TOUGH!

so thanks claireforjames for being the voice of reason and understanding how i feel as a mother, you were spot on!

[Solysombra]

Claire4James, please don't feel sorry for me, people have been coming to me for advice for forty years and my advice has been generally well received and provided me with a very comfortable lifestyle,
I feel sorry for you and Beachdragon that you are unable to comprehend the essence of my postings on this subject, the hidden or perhaps unspoken content was the word "safety.

As an engineer I spent two thirds of my life being super safety concious, whatever I design or build will be done so with three primary built in factors, safety, safety and safety, with this in mind I felel perfectly justified in asking the question "if you are afraid of your child drowning in a swimming pool then why do you want to have one", I think it's a perfectly logical question.

My comments may be interpreted as being a little caustic but sometimes one needs to be cruel to be kind, once again I'm sorry you were unable to interpret the deeper and perhaps more important meaning, I'm done now!

[Shukran]

I'd certainly go for a personal pool even with young children - that's the way they start to feel completely at home in the water.

You haven't mentioned if any of them swim yet? I feel that the priority is to get them all swimming, albeit doggy paddling, before you come out and the 6 week old as soon as possible, and any of them that are still not comfortable with the water by the time you come over should wear armbands at all times whilst in the garden.

We all know how easy it is to take your eyes of them for a couple of seconds - why is it that they always chose that moment to do something mad or bad?

My daughter was swimming well by 2 yrs but I still think that wasn't young enough. I remember an incident at a hotel swimming pool when a young toddler, very wobbly on his little legs and couldn't have been older than 12 months, toddled towards the deep end of the pool in his armbands and just plopped in. I jumped up and ran towards him, only to find that he was doggy paddling like a professional and screaming with delight. He had no fear at all and it was lovely to see.

Good luck with everything, I'm sure it'll all turn out right in the end.

[alaninspain]

I read in one of the local English papers a week or so ago about a company that markets open view strong netting for swimming pools, with each square size about 6 inches square. It winds up like a debris cover and stays taut. If a baby falls in they stay above the water but secure on the netting. It is a USA product and I think the piece I saw was requesting agents in the area. Perhaps someone else remembers the product better than me, we have communal pools and my memory bank is not what it used to be. Good luck.

[silver]

open view strong netting for swimming pools,

You can get katchakid in Alhaurin el Grande

[katy]

I have temporary one its a bit stronger than netting and the ones they sell here arent as good. This is at our house if Florida as it is the law there if you want to rent, also the patio doors must have an alarm on so that you are aware it is opened. There have been a few childrens deaths here mainly amongst holiday renters, one two years ago in mijas where the grandfather was left in charge and he dozed off.

[Beachdragon]

soly you say you have to be cruel to be kind but i have no idea why.

im not stupid, surely you could air your views in a far nicer and kinder way and people would listen to you far more. if we all had the same views and opinions on things the world would be a very boring place, its HOW you share your views with others that matters.

Thanks for everyones advice on netting thats a great idea. katy why did you slag me off for asking about a pool if you also have one? im confused

[katy]

What are you going on about? I didn't slag you off about a pool. I think that sol implied that people who rent out are not going to be bothered about your childrens safety and I would go along with that as if I were renting here I wouldn't be prepared to put up gates/fences etc. (unless it were the law) You asked for advice you don't always get what you want to hear, I could say that all the landlords will bend over backwards to accommodate your wishes and whether I think they should/shouldn't...they won't.

[peteroldracer]

look in the english language free press or on Google for "Deep Blue Pool" - they exhibit at the Homes & Gardens shows in the exhibition centre in Malaga