Coronavirus

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olive
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby olive » Thu Jul 02, 2020 8:58 pm

jhonie99 wrote: Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:49 am Simple..........

They're going to apply for the latest free money (IVM) and then continue to work in the black.

I'd go as far as saying........poverty doesn't exist in Spain.
My partner in INSS is dealing with them everyday. He wonders how they can afford the latest iphones.
Quite funny at the moment how everyone is setting themselves up to receive the free money (dumb EU!!). The casa de campos are quickly filling up with family members registering as living alone, blah blah blah.

Back to flights...
U people are panicking unnecessarily. Life is going on as normal in Spain. I've had 4 flights now in 5 weeks and I'm still alive.
5 weeks ago, internal flight in mainland followed by mainland canarias flight. Police checks before and after each flight, with interviews, targeting foreigners like me. On the whole, no problems. All v efficient. The nice thing being that people are more relaxed, keeping discrete distance and more aware of surroundings. It's all about compliance, compliance, compliance. The Spanish Regime are loving it. Stop, go, wait, wait, stop, go, stop, etc.

Yesterday, flight within canarias plus flight canarias to mainland. Not a hope of avoiding infection, too many people and that's only the beginning. I'm not concerned, as being infected is the only way forward (Lockdown was and is a totally stupid idea - merely postpones the pain).
Ryanair boarding was manual (pen and paper). So, the staff physically took the phone from every individual to read the codes, lol. I held it from him at a distance - he still grabbed it.

So, just get on with it - we all got to die from something.
Being infected is the way forward? Are you making the assumption that a) you wont catch it again once you have had it? ( can you get flu more than once) b) having got it you will survive and crucially without some form of permanent damage to organs or parts of your body?

People with underlying health problems ( mostly but not exclusively older people) have quite different views

markwilding
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby markwilding » Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:11 pm

The only ones who get Erte are those who are on contracts and pay their taxes. Also Erte is only paid to employees if their employer reemploys their staff for at least six months after the return. If they are not paying taxes on their earnings, they can't claim.

If the employer doesn't continue the contract then in effect you are being made redundant and redundancy payments would need to be paid and the government would have to pay unemployment anyway.

https://www.citizensadvice.org.es/faq/c ... rs-rights/



I agree that for many being paid while not working was not so bad, My Brother in law was not in a rush to go back but was back at work 2 weeks ago.

I would question the idea that all unemployed people have the latest Iphone, I don't think so. Yes, probably most people these days have some sort of Smart Phone but In the modern world I would say having one was actually essential for businesses and kids to get through the lockdown. Without some type of connected device, It would have put someone at a major disadvantage.
Last edited by markwilding on Fri Jul 03, 2020 8:52 am, edited 4 times in total.

katy
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby katy » Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:17 pm

IMF says that Spain will be the country that suffers the most from the world fiasco. Although they are frequently wrong with their forecasts.

Paulinmalaga
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Paulinmalaga » Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:45 pm

Pretty much on a par with Italy and France with U.K and Germany only marginally better on their Outlook

https://www.imf.org/en/Publications/WEO ... teJune2020
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Lavanda
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Lavanda » Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:09 pm

I've just been shopping in the Mercadona in 40ºC (but not in the shop, thank goodness) with mask and gloves on and my glasses so I can see things. I began to perspire. In fact, my face got hot, red and wet. Perspiration drops trickled into my eyes and stung. I was tempted to wipe my eyes but remembered not to touch my face, etc. Perspiration formed on my upper lip and dribbled into my mouth. It was very hot.

It occurs to me that the stupid people who are telling us to use masks when we cannot self-distance simply do not live in the real, practical world of Summer in Spain. For the first time in four months I felt unsafe and in possible danger of getting this virus. I would have felt safer without the mask. I understand the mask is to stop me infecting others but what about self-infecting through mask wearing. Do we have any data on that and if not, why not?

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Enrique
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Enrique » Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:29 pm

Hi Lavanda,

Get yourself a towelling tennis head band.............. :idea:
All my best learning experiences start with a problem I need to solve.

Lavanda
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Lavanda » Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:39 pm

Brilliant idea!!!

gavilan
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby gavilan » Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:02 pm

sorry to go back to 21 June but something Beachcomber wrote then has been on my mind ever since ... he wrote: 'The whole thing is a complete farce and I mean the whole thing.' ... I would like to ask him ... ?how would you have managed such a health crisis... ?what would you have done differently? ... I ask in all seriousness ...

Lavanda
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Lavanda » Sat Jul 04, 2020 9:08 pm

Maybe we could throw open that question for everyone, as well?

gavilan
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby gavilan » Sat Jul 04, 2020 11:13 pm

Lavanda: I am happy with your suggestion ...

olive
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby olive » Sat Jul 04, 2020 11:29 pm

Not saying they should have but here are two.

Firstly they could have ring fenced the vulnerable e.g. the sick and elderly in care homes. Part of the process would have included the care home staff living in or on the premises. No visitors and ppe used at interfaces like delivery of supplies. The rest of society would have just carried on as normal with as happened vulnerable people self isolating for 12 weeks or longer, with the support.

Secondly they could have done nothing ( like say a flu epidemic) and had maybe double or ten times more deaths. Callously weeding out the sick, aged and vulnerable. That is what happens in nature and reduces the overhead on the pack. The health service would have been overrun but the economy would have continued and wouldn't have built up the astronomical debt that ten years ago in The years of austerity wouldn't have been entertained. Also millions less would have lost their livelihoods and spent ten more years clawing their way back onto the property ladder/escaping living with parents/ relying on grandparents pensions.

Lavanda
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Lavanda » Sun Jul 05, 2020 6:53 am

I think that anything I would have done differently is, obviously, done with the benefit of hindsight. I actually agree with Beachcomber. The whole thing has been and still is ridiculous. Once the pattern of deaths of the sick and elderly became apparent I think Olive is right; protect the vulnerable and lift the lockdown (months ago) and let people get on with their lives, jobs, businesses, education and everything else. We face years of economic mess and for what — to give some very old and sick people a few more years of living in care homes with dementia.

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Devils Advocate
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Devils Advocate » Sun Jul 05, 2020 8:49 am

Good summary Olive.....most of it I would have wrote myself.
Property owner in Andalucia since 2002. How time flies.

katy
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby katy » Sun Jul 05, 2020 9:08 am

Agree with Olive and Lavanda. Perhaps a short lockdown for 3 weeks max in the beginning. Most are in care homes for a reason such as dementia. Not just memory loss, they are doubly incontinent, can’t feed themselves. Not what most would want for themselves.
I think the world is suffering from mass hysteria. If lockdowns carry on there will be no health services to cure anything.

Lavanda
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Lavanda » Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:04 pm

Spot on, Katy.

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peteroldracer
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby peteroldracer » Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:15 pm

Well what an evil pair of witches! Just writing off people who will be someone’s mother, grandma, uncle, husband....reminds me of the poison that too many people spat at the McCanns.
I used to cough to disguise a [email protected] I f@rt to disguise a cough.

gavilan
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby gavilan » Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:39 pm

we havent heard from Beachcomber yet ... maybe I made the mistake of referrring to a 'health crisis' ?

Pamela1
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Pamela1 » Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:56 pm

I have no poison for the McCanns at and i'd hate to have had my daughter stolen away from me! The one and only thing i can not understand is how people can feel relaxed about leaving their children alone in a hotel room whether they are asleep or not..The furthest i've been away from my own kids is the back garden when they have been askeep in bed...
Peter i presume your post refers to Lavanda and Katy? I have a feeling Olive is a man but i could be wrong. :lol: I must be a witch too because i agree with every single word they both said..

katy
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby katy » Sun Jul 05, 2020 1:02 pm

peteroldracer wrote: Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:15 pm Well what an evil pair of witches! Just writing off people who will be someone’s mother, grandma, uncle, husband....reminds me of the poison that too many people spat at the McCanns.
I did include myself. Anyone who has known someone with dementia would not wish it on their loved ones. They don’t just sit around singing white cliffs of Dover and watching TV! Cousin’s husband had Alzheimer’s for 8 years. Aside from this he was fit and healthy until later stages. After the first 2 years he started to become paranoid and delusional which led to him being abusive and violent. As it progressed he became doubly incontinent, needed feeding, dressing etc and then lacked the ability to form a word together. They usually die of pneumonia brought on by the inability to swallow correctly ( now diagnosed as COVID-19 for many). I visited him once and was shocked as there were many just the same.
What’s the McCanns got to do with it, no one got personal, except you. Hope you aren’t losing it.

K&LTupper
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby K&LTupper » Sun Jul 05, 2020 1:06 pm

gavilan wrote: Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:39 pm we havent heard from Beachcomber yet ... maybe I made the mistake of referrring to a 'health crisis' ?
I'm also looking forward to reading the reply to your original question


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