Coronavirus

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Pamela1
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Pamela1 » Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:36 pm

Wonder what happened to the story which they sold everyone last year, a vaccine would be the end of all our problems! :lol:

Paddy Pumpkin
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:11 pm

Positive Covid tests don't kill or put people in hospital. Covid kills people. The only reason we are tested is to try to prevent the spread and also it serves as a proxy to estimate when there will be a pressure on the health system as hospital admissions and deaths lag a few weeks behind. If you stop testing then you will find out too late what is coming. That is what happened in March...Europe ignored the issue because they had no idea it was there because they weren't looking i.e. testing

27 EU countries, 350,000 excess deaths...and before anyone says that is because of people not getting treated for other illnesses please look at the graph and see that the excess deaths started mid March
https://www.euromomo.eu/graphs-and-maps ... -mortality

Paddy Pumpkin
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:15 pm

firsttango wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 3:32 pm
Paddy Pumpkin wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 2:20 pm Ahhh sorry I didn't pick up the sarcasm

https://edition.cnn.com/interactive/202 ... t-tracker/

I don't think the guy on this link was being sarcastic !


Home being Madrid or eSpain in general.
Neither was this guy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpiEN0e5XnA

Recent studies show lockdowns work and yet other studies show lockdowns Don't work......pick your study to suit your narrative......but hey if lockdowns work why are the U.K on their third.....lives and economies destroyed to still be at square one :silent:
[/quote

The UK (insert name of many countries here) is on it's third lockdown because they never finished the job off you have to get the number to zero and then keep it there. The UK neither got it to zero nor had a competent plan that they executed to keep it at zero. Aus, NZ and Singapore all implemented lockdown with a target of zero cases and then executed their plans to keep it there. 50,000 at sports events and they are not paying for Xmas

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firsttango
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby firsttango » Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:30 pm

All 3 of your examples much smaller populations very low density living so much easier to manage a lockdown...surprised you didn't bolt on the Scilly Isles for good measure......you do love using figures to suit your narrative......a lockdown will never work in the West.....Fact......so why continue the farce.

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firsttango
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby firsttango » Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:42 pm

Paddy Pumpkin wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:11 pm Positive Covid tests don't kill or put people in hospital. Covid kills people. The only reason we are tested is to try to prevent the spread and also it serves as a proxy to estimate when there will be a pressure on the health system as hospital admissions and deaths lag a few weeks behind. If you stop testing then you will find out too late what is coming. That is what happened in March...Europe ignored the issue because they had no idea it was there because they weren't looking i.e. testing

27 EU countries, 350,000 excess deaths...and before anyone says that is because of people not getting treated for other illnesses please look at the graph and see that the excess deaths started mid March
https://www.euromomo.eu/graphs-and-maps ... -mortality
Out of a population of over 447,000,000 that is negligible and only slightly more than the bad flu season of 2017/18 (using your graph as reference) :wink:

Beachcomber
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Beachcomber » Fri Jan 22, 2021 9:43 am

The World Health Organisation now admits that the way PCR tests are conducted gives a huge amount of false positives:

https://principia-scientific.com/who-fi ... a-problem/

https://www.who.int/news/item/20-01-202 ... rs-2020-05

The more than 90% false positive results of these tests as well as the lumping together as PIC (pneumonia-influenza-covid) deaths rather than just deaths from covid are solely designed to inflate the figures and allow organisations and individuals to manipulate statistics to suit their own agenda and have resulted in unnecessary devastating lock-downs and illegal health damaging mask mandates.

Paddy Pumpkin
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Fri Jan 22, 2021 10:21 am

firsttango wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:30 pm All 3 of your examples much smaller populations very low density living so much easier to manage a lockdown...surprised you didn't bolt on the Scilly Isles for good measure......you do love using figures to suit your narrative......a lockdown will never work in the West.....Fact......so why continue the farce.
Singapore...low density? 8,358 per square km. That is 30 times the denisty of the UK. I think that knocks your low density argument out of the water.
But you do admit lockdowns work if managed properly.

Yes I use figures to suit my narrative rather than broad sweepeing statements like lockdowns don't work. As long as there are examples were lockdowns did work then your statement that lockdowns don't work is incorrect. They clearly do if implemented correctly as per my examples.

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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Fri Jan 22, 2021 10:32 am

firsttango wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:42 pm
Paddy Pumpkin wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:11 pm Positive Covid tests don't kill or put people in hospital. Covid kills people. The only reason we are tested is to try to prevent the spread and also it serves as a proxy to estimate when there will be a pressure on the health system as hospital admissions and deaths lag a few weeks behind. If you stop testing then you will find out too late what is coming. That is what happened in March...Europe ignored the issue because they had no idea it was there because they weren't looking i.e. testing

27 EU countries, 350,000 excess deaths...and before anyone says that is because of people not getting treated for other illnesses please look at the graph and see that the excess deaths started mid March
https://www.euromomo.eu/graphs-and-maps ... -mortality
Out of a population of over 447,000,000 that is negligible and only slightly more than the bad flu season of 2017/18 (using your graph as reference) :wink:
350,000 is excess ...not actual. Every year in the EU about 5.2 million people die, so 7% more people died than expected. If you could decrease the likelyhood of dieing by 7% you would Einstein look like the village idiot.

Additionally that 350k number is in excess of the 17/18 year as the 350k takes the last 5 years as the base line.

Paddy Pumpkin
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Fri Jan 22, 2021 10:34 am

Beachcomber wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 9:43 am The World Health Organisation now admits that the way PCR tests are conducted gives a huge amount of false positives:

https://principia-scientific.com/who-fi ... a-problem/

https://www.who.int/news/item/20-01-202 ... rs-2020-05

The more than 90% false positive results of these tests as well as the lumping together as PIC (pneumonia-influenza-covid) deaths rather than just deaths from covid are solely designed to inflate the figures and allow organisations and individuals to manipulate statistics to suit their own agenda and have resulted in unnecessary devastating lock-downs and illegal health damaging mask mandates.
Do you have an alternative solution for the struggling health services?

katy
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby katy » Fri Jan 22, 2021 12:21 pm

Beachcomber wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 9:43 am The World Health Organisation now admits that the way PCR tests are conducted gives a huge amount of false positives:

https://principia-scientific.com/who-fi ... a-problem/

https://www.who.int/news/item/20-01-202 ... rs-2020-05

The more than 90% false positive results of these tests as well as the lumping together as PIC (pneumonia-influenza-covid) deaths rather than just deaths from covid are solely designed to inflate the figures and allow organisations and individuals to manipulate statistics to suit their own agenda and have resulted in unnecessary devastating lock-downs and illegal health damaging mask mandates.
Just a thought, maybe having the vaccine would turn up a false positive if test needed for travel.

Pamela1
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Pamela1 » Fri Jan 22, 2021 12:27 pm

So Beachcomber, basically we have been conned? :crazy:

Beachcomber
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Beachcomber » Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:40 pm

Yes, we have been scammed right from the beginning.

ashtondav
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby ashtondav » Fri Jan 22, 2021 2:10 pm

Don’t need stats. Just look at the hospital wards.

Beachcomber
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Beachcomber » Fri Jan 22, 2021 2:53 pm


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firsttango
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby firsttango » Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:12 pm

Paddy Pumpkin wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 10:32 am
firsttango wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:42 pm
Paddy Pumpkin wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:11 pm Positive Covid tests don't kill or put people in hospital. Covid kills people. The only reason we are tested is to try to prevent the spread and also it serves as a proxy to estimate when there will be a pressure on the health system as hospital admissions and deaths lag a few weeks behind. If you stop testing then you will find out too late what is coming. That is what happened in March...Europe ignored the issue because they had no idea it was there because they weren't looking i.e. testing

27 EU countries, 350,000 excess deaths...and before anyone says that is because of people not getting treated for other illnesses please look at the graph and see that the excess deaths started mid March
https://www.euromomo.eu/graphs-and-maps ... -mortality
Out of a population of over 447,000,000 that is negligible and only slightly more than the bad flu season of 2017/18 (using your graph as reference) :wink:
350,000 is excess ...not actual. Every year in the EU about 5.2 million people die, so 7% more people died than expected. If you could decrease the likelyhood of dieing by 7% you would Einstein look like the village idiot.

Additionally that 350k number is in excess of the 17/18 year as the 350k takes the last 5 years as the base line.
Err yes Excess deaths and still negligible compared to overall population of 447 million.....you're starting to ramble now and not making much sense. :lol:

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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Lavanda » Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:38 pm

Also, Paddy, I hate myself for doing this but it's dying and not dieing, but all of us do typos at times.

Paddy Pumpkin
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Fri Jan 22, 2021 4:06 pm

2019. There was 4.65 million deaths in the EU 27. So you view 350k extra deaths as statistically insignificant. 350k in 10 months is 420k per year. So 420k against 4.65m is a 9% increase. A 9% increase in a probability is huge.

Blackjack gives the house a 1% advantage so 49.5 to 50.5 and tell me a casino that loses money on the tables. They don't. Imagine how much they would win if they could increase the probability of winning each hand by 9%. The game would be 45/55.


In Texas Hold em Poker that same 9% probability is the differential in having a pair of Jacks and a pair of 2s with 3 people at the table. So you are playing would you like to swap the 2s for the Jacks?

Paddy Pumpkin
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Fri Jan 22, 2021 4:08 pm

Lavanda wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:38 pm Also, Paddy, I hate myself for doing this but it's dying and not dieing, but all of us do typos at times.
As you can see I can understand maths but failed English.

Paddy Pumpkin
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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Fri Jan 22, 2021 5:22 pm

Actually here is a version of the maths in a game that is easier to understand I think. I have rounded the number just to make it easier to see.

Say we play a game 99 back balls in a bag amd 1 white ball. This represents the 1 % of the population of the EU who die every. There are 2 identical bags 1 for me and 1 for the other player.

Here is the game. If I draw the white ball in my bag you owe me 1 million EUR. If you draw the white ball in your bag I owe you 1 million EUR. If we both or neither draw a white ball then nobody has to pay. 1 chance to draw each. So you have 1 in 100 chance to draw the ball I.e. 1%. This mirrors the chance of dying in a given year.

Just before we start the game I say...actually can we stop and come back and play the game here in 20 years, with one change I want my chances of drawing the ball to increase by 9% each year....this mirrors the increase in death rate caused by Covid in the EU. For this change in the rules I will give you 100 EUR now in cash. Since you think 9% increase in the probability of drawing the ball is insignificant because you only had 1% chance in the beginning you say sure no problem and pocket the money.

20 years later we sit down you have your bag with 1 white ball and I have my bag where the number of insignificant 1 white ball increased by 9% (did I mention the 1 white ball was an insignificant number so it doesn't really matter that it grew because 9% of 1 is nothing ). Well now 20 years later my 1 white ball is now 7 white balls in the bag. Do you still want to play for 1 million EUR? Your 1 in 100 chance vs my 7 in 100 chance?

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Re: Coronavirus

Postby Beachcomber » Fri Jan 22, 2021 6:04 pm

This has to be a link to RT (and why not) because the facts do not conform to the mainstream media agenda:

https://www.rt.com/op-ed/507937-covid-p ... yri8Mk54Es


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