Vaccine war with EU

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Pamela1
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby Pamela1 » Thu Apr 15, 2021 4:50 pm

olive wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 4:11 pm
markwilding wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 1:40 pm Personally, I can't understand why there is so much competitiveness. Most of it is nothing more than political one-upmanship. What is important is that everybody in Europe and then the world beyond has the the opportunity to take a vaccine.
Fear and anger are just two reasons.
Fear that a person might cop it or have their life changed by being ill and then recovering.
Anger at the injected delay by Brussels sitting on their thumbs. I did explain this earlier but I think it got deleted. The end result is now, this year, we have a two tier Europe. Those that have got large numbers of their country vaccinated and the people can lead ,potentially, a more normal life including foreign travel. Then there are those - like us in Andalucia waiting for a first vaccine date. Without those vaccinations, I can see our Andalucian lockdown measures continuing in perpetuity for residents. That means no travel outside of our province and no possibility of seeing family and friends in UK for the last time.

You are right that it is important to get nations vaccinated. Buy shares in Pharmas. The new normal will be a large percentage of the population jabbed for each and every variant and booster jabs.
Olive i can understand your frustration, especially regarding the no travel to see family and friends in the Uk for possibly the last time, we may be in a tier two Europe but because of this it means those of us who need to get into Andalucia for the same reasons as those you mentioned are no better off. It is heart breaking and you have every right to be angry.

katy
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby katy » Thu Apr 15, 2021 5:41 pm

Not the favourite person of the Wokes but he makes some of the points I did. Bet most of us think the same.
Time to face Covid.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/14650994/ ... -in-masks/

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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:04 pm

The Data from Israel directly contradicts this hypothesis.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccar ... b865632d93

Israel is at roughly 60% of people having had 2 shots of vaccine. Life is almost back to normal for the population of 10 million (Goggle the pictures of Easter in Jerusalem) and deaths are in single figures per day. Only 10 weeks ago there was 12,000 cases per day now it's less than 200 per day.

Pamela1
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby Pamela1 » Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:43 pm

Good to see that people in Israel are getting their lives back, long may it last. :thumbup:

katy
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby katy » Thu Apr 15, 2021 10:24 pm

katy wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 10:20 am According to SKY this morning 15.5% have had two doses. I would just like to watch the morning news with my coffee and Covid given a minute slot at the end along with the Duke of Edinburgh :D
.now 16.2% had second dose.

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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby Lavanda » Fri Apr 16, 2021 6:45 am

"Olive i can understand your frustration, especially regarding the no travel to see family and friends in the Uk"

but that is not true, Mark. I am off to see my parents in a few weeks. It's a question of new TIE and IDP (Brexit stuff) and a P-thing test plus filling in a form about my quarantine and a lot of hassle BUT it is possible to go to the UK. Of course it is. (Sorry Sid, wrong thread I know but it is information).

markwilding
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby markwilding » Fri Apr 16, 2021 8:15 am

I'm not sure if you meant to refer to me but I already know that the restrictions are on the UK side and even then for taking holidays .On the Spanish side it is perfectly possible to travel to the UK provided the rules are followed. The other day a member posted an interesting article about a family's experience of travelling to the UK and back to Spain.

My wife and I have decided to put trips there on hold for the moment but I'm in a completely different situation as you because both my parents have passed, Travelling to Spain from the UK was restricted to residents among others but I read somewhere that these were to be lifted so might not be in force by the time you travel. I mean the TIE won't be a condition of travelling to Spain forever.

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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Fri Apr 16, 2021 11:03 am

katy wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 10:24 pm
katy wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 10:20 am According to SKY this morning 15.5% have had two doses. I would just like to watch the morning news with my coffee and Covid given a minute slot at the end along with the Duke of Edinburgh :D
.now 16.2% had second dose.
I am not sure where SKY is getting their data from. Do they have a system to collect data that covers every clinic in the UK and is more up to date than the government or are SKY simply mis reporting?
Here is the source data.

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/vaccinations

As of 5pm on Thursday 15th April the UK had administered 8,513, 864 second doses.

That represents less than 13% of the population of the UK. Keep in mind herd immunity is not achieved by vaccinating 70% of the people you intend to vaccinate, it is achieved by vaccinating 70% of the total population of the UK.

Beachcomber
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby Beachcomber » Fri Apr 16, 2021 11:37 am

The changing definition of herd immunity:

Herd immunity.jpg

markwilding
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby markwilding » Fri Apr 16, 2021 11:53 am

It's common knowledge that herd immunity from Measles, mumps, polio, and chickenpox which are examples of infectious diseases and which were once very common was achieved through taking vaccines. What I didn't know before Covid was the process was called 'Herd Immunity'

Lavanda
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby Lavanda » Fri Apr 16, 2021 12:04 pm

'Herd' yes but it's a bit insulting. I think it was that idiot Boris who started to talk about herd immunity.

We are people and we need crowd immunity.

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firsttango
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby firsttango » Fri Apr 16, 2021 12:10 pm


Beachcomber
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby Beachcomber » Fri Apr 16, 2021 12:20 pm

AstraZeneca has now attracted nearly a half a million adverse events and 521 deaths in the UK alone. I think it may have lost the 'vaccine war with the EU'.

Latest figures from the deeply embedded Yellow Card reporting system which is actually two weeks behind real time:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... -reactions

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firsttango
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby firsttango » Fri Apr 16, 2021 12:26 pm

Quite Scary as to what the medium and long term effects of AZ jab may be :thumbdown:

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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby Lavanda » Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:51 pm

Yet the AZ is made with tried and tested technology. It's the Pfizer and Moderna ones that have the untried technology.

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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby katy » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:14 pm

Which brings us back to the vaccine war as Moderna, Pfizer also has similar symptoms.

markwilding
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby markwilding » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:15 pm

The question isn’t how many people died after taking the vaccine but how many died due to taking the vaccine. All of them are investigated and it certainly was nothing like the amount quoted. Not even more than a couple.
Everyone knows the adverse effects and in fact, I was given a pamphlet with information about possible side effects and what to do if any occur.

I did have tiredness and a little pain when I touched the area around where I received the jab

If you read the very same link that is constantly posted with the statistics, it makes it clear that the benefits outweigh the drawbacks. Because someone of my age is more likely to die if I catch COVID than from having the jab.
Last edited by markwilding on Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:21 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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firsttango
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby firsttango » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:18 pm

Lavanda wrote: Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:51 pm Yet the AZ is made with tried and tested technology. It's the Pfizer and Moderna ones that have the untried technology.
Just goes to show that you can't rush these things to market in a few short months without adequate trials and testing regarding a novel virus.......god only knows what the future medium/long term outcomes are for the mRNA jabs

katy
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby katy » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:19 pm

Mark, The only tiredness I had was because I was given an 8.05am appointment :wink:

markwilding
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Re: Vaccine war with EU

Postby markwilding » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:23 pm

I put the tiredness down to the jab but could easily have been because I was on a 2 week break and I often feel tired for the first few days as I start to relax a little.


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