Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

For tips, tricks and secrets on good health, beauty, fitness and sport join this forum.
Beachcomber
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 10846
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 11:11 pm
Location: Guadalhorce Valley

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby Beachcomber » Mon May 03, 2021 2:43 pm

Thanks for that link, Katy.

I think I can at least throw some light on this from the article:

The reasoning behind administering the jab is that temporary exposure to the toxin may provide long-term protection against becoming ill from the virus. Early indications are that this strategy is working, although it is not at all certain yet to what extent the fall-off in infection rates seen in intensely vaccinated populations is seasonal and related to the waves of infection, or if it is a lasting benefit.

Remember this post:

Beachcomber wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 9:43 am The World Health Organisation now admits that the way PCR tests are conducted gives a huge amount of false positives:

https://principia-scientific.com/who-fi ... a-problem/

https://www.who.int/news/item/20-01-202 ... rs-2020-05

The more than 90% false positive results of these tests as well as the lumping together as PIC (pneumonia-influenza-covid) deaths rather than just deaths from covid are solely designed to inflate the figures and allow organisations and individuals to manipulate statistics to suit their own agenda and have resulted in unnecessary devastating lock-downs and illegal health damaging mask mandates.
I naively thought it possible that the World Health Organisation had recognised the error in using 40 or 45 cycles when conducting these tests but, no, it was paving the way for this:

Sequencing.jpg
Taken from this document

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/d ... gation.pdf

We now know why the World Heath Organisation decided to concern itself with this matter.

Notionally, the system has produced its miracle cure. Everyone who has been injected, will be tested “under the new WHO guidelines”, and running only 28 cycles or fewer whilst the tests on the great unjabbed used to justify lockdowns, mask mandates, social distancing, travel restrictions, destruction of people's lives and the world economy and, no doubt, to coerce and frighten people into being injected will continue to be conducted at the highly inflated rate of 40+ cycles.

Lo and behold, the number of “positive cases” of the compliant injected will plummet, and we’ll have confirmation that the world's miracle concoction works.

I look forward to somebody relating it to the fact that 'if you have 45 green bottles hanging on a wall and 17 of them accidentally fall you will be left with the perfectly acceptable figure of 28' or some equally ridiculous analogy.

Paddy Pumpkin
Resident
Posts: 858
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 12:06 pm
Location: Madrid

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Mon May 03, 2021 3:54 pm

markwilding wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 2:07 pm It seems that me and 34,505,380 just in the UK others up to Saturday. Just saying that so many people have died after taking one of the vaccine without going into the reasons for the deaths has no merit, especially as at one point almost 2,000 people a day were day from Covid at its peak last winter. The obvious conclusion is for someone my age living in a high risk area where the current numbers are almost 700 in a 14 day period over the last 14days , the risk of not taking preventative measure are much higher than doing so.

I will leave it to Paddy to give us the actual statistics

Again I will repeat, You will no doubt contest the figures with dubious accounts from other deniers taken from known anti vax sources where so called experts offer their opinion but with absolutely no research to back them up. If there is, show us the peer reviewed research papers to back up their self promotional You Tube lies.

Sorry Mark I won't go into the statistics as it was stated by others that the statistics are useless. Unless of course they themselves come up with a statistics they like.

To quote some posts
'A virus which has a 99+% survival rate'
Later became...... 'a survival rate of 97,88% across all age ranges'
That later became....'The figures don't mean much anyway'

I want to make informed consent but the story keeps changing and when I ask questions about things they never get answered. Also when I come to a mathematically correct conclusion, based on data supplied by other commentators, that shows inconsistencies with the original statement my conclusion is not disputed.

So I am caught between government data that I am told I cannot trust by some people and data that I know is incorrect supplied by those same people who tell me to trust them when they tell me that government data is untrustworthy.

User avatar
firsttango
Resident
Posts: 1774
Joined: Tue Jan 14, 2014 5:34 pm
Location: Velez-Malaga

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby firsttango » Mon May 03, 2021 4:08 pm

Simple solution.....just pop on your big boy pants and do what grown ups do every minute of the day and based on current facts at your disposal make an informed adult decision for yourself then either way the buck stops with you :D

markwilding
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 7318
Joined: Fri Aug 14, 2009 11:02 am
Location: Bilbao Spain

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby markwilding » Mon May 03, 2021 4:41 pm

It seems you are unable to have an debate without trying to insult people whose opinions differ from yours

I, as have the vast majority of members put on record of our decision, having taken all the information at our disposal including the posts from anti vaxxer and liberal thinkers who want the right to choose.

I thought Beachcomber asked when starting the thread that nobody should be bullied if they don’t want to take a vaccine, which I thought was a reasonable request but I naturally assumed that it would work both ways.

My natural response is to give as good as I get but I would prefer to respect the OP request.
Last edited by markwilding on Mon May 03, 2021 4:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
firsttango
Resident
Posts: 1774
Joined: Tue Jan 14, 2014 5:34 pm
Location: Velez-Malaga

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby firsttango » Mon May 03, 2021 4:47 pm

I think we have a very different definition of the word "insult" however, you do seem to want/need to be perpetually offended by posters/posts which question you and when confronted with such posts that you are unable to refute you either don't reply or you play the "woke card" :wink:

Beachcomber
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 10846
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 11:11 pm
Location: Guadalhorce Valley

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby Beachcomber » Mon May 03, 2021 5:24 pm

More distasteful news from the UK:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/0 ... -say-peer/

Why on earth infect (no, not a 'typo') children with an unapproved, experimental drug that does not prevent infection or transmission for a virus from which they have a 99+% survival rate and with a far higher chance of damaging their health particularly given the type of side effects that are currently being experienced by thousands of women around the world?

Perhaps one of the most disgusting things about this story is that headmasters boast that “peer pressure” will boost take up. I wonder if they will be so smug when the law suits start rolling in or are they going to be exempt from prosecution as well?

markwilding
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 7318
Joined: Fri Aug 14, 2009 11:02 am
Location: Bilbao Spain

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby markwilding » Mon May 03, 2021 8:34 pm

firsttango wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 4:47 pm I think we have a very different definition of the word "insult" however, you do seem to want/need to be perpetually offended by posters/posts which question you and when confronted with such posts that you are unable to refute you either don't reply or you play the "woke card" :wink:
I have given up replying to most of the stuff you post because most of it is nothing more than links with no opinion attached. The last one responding to the Dying in the streets looked nothing more than a screenshot of a social media post and didn't warrant a response. You have tried to wind up half the forum over the years and what is clear your views have veered from one extreme at the beginning of this pandemic to the complete opposite extreme now

And yes I do take offence at you telling me to pull my big boy pants up as would anyone. I doubt you would use that sort of language in a real life situation so why use it here?

User avatar
firsttango
Resident
Posts: 1774
Joined: Tue Jan 14, 2014 5:34 pm
Location: Velez-Malaga

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby firsttango » Mon May 03, 2021 9:19 pm

markwilding wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 8:34 pm
firsttango wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 4:47 pm I think we have a very different definition of the word "insult" however, you do seem to want/need to be perpetually offended by posters/posts which question you and when confronted with such posts that you are unable to refute you either don't reply or you play the "woke card" :wink:
I have given up replying to the stuff you post because most of it is nothing more than links with no opinion attached. The last one responding to the Dying in the streets looked nothing more than a screenshot of a social media post and didn't warrant a response. You have tried to wind up half the forum over the years and what is clear your views have veered from one extreme at the beginning of this pandemic to the complete opposite extreme now

And yes I do take offence at you telling me to pull my big boy pants up as would anyone. I doubt you would use that sort of language in a real life situation so why use it here?
Total nonsense and it wasn't even in this thread and was accompanied by opinion and text as well as 2 examples of how fake images are being used across Media platforms, what else would it be other than a screenshot? And the original was originally posted by West Bengal Chief Minister Mamata Banerjee before it went viral. You actually did respond to that post so I can't see why you'd blatantly lie and say "it didn't warrant a response".

The big boy pants was not aimed at you......it didn't even follow one of your posts, but if the cap fits. But its laughable that you find this language insulting and not to be used in public........tell that to the Mayor of Philadelphia, didn't see the Donald get on the "offended bus" and that was on global newsfeeds and in a real life situation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QN5FpjMBY2w

Wind up the Forum? Really, I suggest you read many of your posts back to yourself...

User avatar
chrissiehope
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 3524
Joined: Sun May 07, 2006 7:52 pm
Location: Cheshire & near Antequera

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby chrissiehope » Mon May 03, 2021 10:43 pm

Sid !!!!
Alexandr for President (Squire for PM !)

Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
Inside of a dog it's too dark to read (Groucho Marx)

Pamela1
Resident
Posts: 1770
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 3:30 am
Location: Co Durham/ Granada Province

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby Pamela1 » Mon May 03, 2021 10:58 pm

Beachcomber wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 5:24 pm More distasteful news from the UK:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/0 ... -say-peer/
They can talk peer presure all they want but that doesn't mean parents will consent..When it comes to children and parents they will be taking on an almighty force of resistance from those parents who will not consent and i think that there will be many parents who will refuse.My son and his wife have been vaccinated but no way are they going to consent to their children being vaccinated.

markwilding
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 7318
Joined: Fri Aug 14, 2009 11:02 am
Location: Bilbao Spain

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby markwilding » Tue May 04, 2021 12:59 am

firsttango wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 2:41 pm "Peer reviewed" seems to be the new words of the moment for some blinkered sheep.......where was the peer reviewed research papers regarding wearing Face Masks back during the first wave? Oh wait.......there weren't any but still the herd donned them regardless.......even Bojo and his scientific advisers said it was a waste of time even affected your health negatively...

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=227850301597915


That's odd, because you were saying the exact opposite back then. To answer your question, you actually posted this link back in July 2020 regarding the benefits of wearing a mask.
firsttango wrote: Wed Jul 15, 2020 6:16 pm Interesting article on the current thinking on the effectiveness of Masks

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/07/ ... isk-by-65/
And you also posted this video which debunks the theory that there are negative health effects
firsttango wrote: Wed Jul 15, 2020 7:38 pm Good little video regarding wearing a mask .....succinctly put.

https://www.facebook.com/essexcoronavir ... 13209/?t=1
And this.....
firsttango wrote: Tue Jul 14, 2020 6:24 pm Be interesting to see if the new rules regarding wearing a mask and the one in particular relating to the beach and walking along the shoreline is adhered to strictly. From a personal opinion I think it a great decision and is imo aimed squarely at the "visitors" to the region and to instil a sense of "we are taking no chances so wear it or risk a hefty fine". Enjoy our beaches and bars etc but respect our rules.

Beachcomber
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 10846
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 11:11 pm
Location: Guadalhorce Valley

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby Beachcomber » Tue May 04, 2021 6:30 am

Pamela1, I agree but in in Washington DC a bill has been passed allowing children from age 11 to be injected without the knowledge or consent of their parents:

https://catholiccitizens.org/issues/chu ... e-consent/

I know it is the USA but we have seen recently that all countries now seem to be following the same script. The link is to a 'fringe' web site but an article in the Washington Post is behind a paywall and the LA Times wants me to turn off my adblocker which I am not going to to so I haven't been able to read it. There was also an item about this on the internet news programme The Hire Wire. If I can find the clip I will post it.

We have seen much of George Orwell's 1984 become reality over the past year but this is more like the plotline from the Spanish Antena 3 drama La Valla. (The Barrier in English and worth a watch if you have Netflix)

User avatar
firsttango
Resident
Posts: 1774
Joined: Tue Jan 14, 2014 5:34 pm
Location: Velez-Malaga

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby firsttango » Tue May 04, 2021 7:46 am

markwilding wrote: Tue May 04, 2021 12:59 am
firsttango wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 2:41 pm "Peer reviewed" seems to be the new words of the moment for some blinkered sheep.......where was the peer reviewed research papers regarding wearing Face Masks back during the first wave? Oh wait.......there weren't any but still the herd donned them regardless.......even Bojo and his scientific advisers said it was a waste of time even affected your health negatively...

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=227850301597915


That's odd, because you were saying the exact opposite back then. To answer your question, you actually posted this link back in July 2020 regarding the benefits of wearing a mask.
firsttango wrote: Wed Jul 15, 2020 6:16 pm Interesting article on the current thinking on the effectiveness of Masks

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/07/ ... isk-by-65/
And you also posted this video which debunks the theory that there are negative health effects
firsttango wrote: Wed Jul 15, 2020 7:38 pm Good little video regarding wearing a mask .....succinctly put.

https://www.facebook.com/essexcoronavir ... 13209/?t=1
And this.....
firsttango wrote: Tue Jul 14, 2020 6:24 pm Be interesting to see if the new rules regarding wearing a mask and the one in particular relating to the beach and walking along the shoreline is adhered to strictly. From a personal opinion I think it a great decision and is imo aimed squarely at the "visitors" to the region and to instil a sense of "we are taking no chances so wear it or risk a hefty fine". Enjoy our beaches and bars etc but respect our rules.
All comments are from a year ago..things change in the real world, opinions change, situations change, perceptions change .......intelligent people in a free society are allowed when presented with evidence such as what was starting to filter through back then to reappraise and change their minds. Governments do this almost on a daily basis regarding this pandemic, people with the ability to do so are also free to alter their opinions. Its actually called having an open mind.

Your infatuation with me and aiming your frustrations at me for whatever reason (think we both know the answer to that) although flattering is starting to feel like you are trolling me......maybe you should get back to mixing with this massive circle of friends you bleat on about having and step away from the forum for at least an hour or so a day, as living in here 24/7 is not good for you :wink:

Now feel free to have the last word but your trolling of me is now very tedious so unless its on topic thats me done with your personal sniping.

Beachcomber
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 10846
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 11:11 pm
Location: Guadalhorce Valley

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby Beachcomber » Tue May 04, 2021 8:04 am

If you wish to continue with this exchange please do so by PM.

Pamela1
Resident
Posts: 1770
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 3:30 am
Location: Co Durham/ Granada Province

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby Pamela1 » Tue May 04, 2021 11:21 am

Beachcomber wrote: Tue May 04, 2021 6:30 am Pamela1, I agree but in in Washington DC a bill has been passed allowing children from age 11 to be injected without the knowledge or consent of their parents:

https://catholiccitizens.org/issues/chu ... e-consent/

I know it is the USA but we have seen recently that all countries now seem to be following the same script. The link is to a 'fringe' web site but an article in the Washington Post is behind a paywall and the LA Times wants me to turn off my adblocker which I am not going to to so I haven't been able to read it. There was also an item about this on the internet news programme The Hire Wire. If I can find the clip I will post it.

We have seen much of George Orwell's 1984 become reality over the past year but this is more like the plotline from the Spanish Antena 3 drama La Valla. (The Barrier in English and worth a watch if you have Netflix)
OMG. I have read the link and it's shocking. :wtf: What is this world we are living in! Children will be manipulated and coerced into accepting the vaccine, some will do it because they will feel pressured and some because they won't be brave enough to say no.It's horrendous the lengths they are willing to go to, it's very worrying and it makes me wonder where else this will lead.

Yes,i watched The Barrier a few months back.. Very disturbing and with much food for thought...I recommended it to my sister and she couldn't get away, she didn't stick with it because she thought it was too far fetched, i think she missed the point :!:

Paddy Pumpkin
Resident
Posts: 858
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 12:06 pm
Location: Madrid

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Tue May 04, 2021 12:14 pm

To give more context to the story this has no connection to Covid. The law was enacted by one school district in response to a measles outbreak.

These types of rules are already in place with medical staff in many countries. For example in the UK if you want to become a nurse you cannot take up your post if you decline vaccination for hepatitis B. Would you want a nurse to be able to pass you a disease?

Having said all of that these types of law are not new. The UK has a law for a compulsory vaccination since 1853 and the US since 1905. Vaccinations are mandatory to attend school in France and Germany.

However I agree that 11 year olds shouldn't be allowed to give consent. Just look at the comments from adults we see on this forum that show that they are incapable of a logical deduction. If an adult cannot then how can we expect a child to?

Beachcomber
Andalucia Guru
Posts: 10846
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2004 11:11 pm
Location: Guadalhorce Valley

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby Beachcomber » Tue May 04, 2021 12:34 pm

I think we are all aware that this is about children being injected without the consent or knowledge of their parents and has nothing to to with the employment conditions of nurses etc and attempting to manipulate the point of the issue with superfluous irrelevant facts is disingenuous and not helpful to anyone.

I think the main danger, apart from the moral one, is that if a child has been administered some kind of medication without the knowledge of the parents and then has to be taken to hospital in a emergency situation by the parent he/she very likely to be asked if the child is on any medication to which the answer would be 'No' which could lead to devastating consequences for the child.

Pamela1
Resident
Posts: 1770
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 3:30 am
Location: Co Durham/ Granada Province

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby Pamela1 » Tue May 04, 2021 12:59 pm

Thank you beach for bringing this back to what it actually is...

PP. Just who are you referring to with your statement? "Just look at the adults we see on this forum" Were you including yourself?
No wonder there is so much bickering going on..

Paddy Pumpkin
Resident
Posts: 858
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 12:06 pm
Location: Madrid

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Tue May 04, 2021 1:36 pm

The question of medication to minors without parental consent or knowledge is nothing new in medical law. In the UK precedent was set in law by what is known as the Gillick Competence. This was a case related to contraception of an U16 but is also applicable to all areas not just medical. Basically it says the child can choose and there is no need for consent of knowledge of the parents.

That later became the Fraser guidelines which set out a test for how to provide contraception to U16 but also applies to other treatments administered by an health professional.

In short the UK the law has allowed compulsory vaccination since 1853 and medication to a minor without parental consent or knowledge since 1985.

Paddy Pumpkin
Resident
Posts: 858
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 12:06 pm
Location: Madrid

Re: Pro Innate Immunity or Anti Vax - Adverse reactions, Etc

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Tue May 04, 2021 2:05 pm

The Vaccination act of 1853
https://api.parliament.uk/historic-hans ... nsion-bill
This link is temperamental so just Google it and it may display better

Medication to minors, there is no specific law. However the UK is a common law jurisdiction which means that laws can be set by precedent.

The precedent was Gillick v West Norfolk and Wisbech Area Health Authority in the House of Lords.
http://www.bailii.org/uk/cases/UKHL/1985/7.html


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 2 guests