New guy introduction and questions

[itsmoirob]

Hey guys,

Just thought I'd introduce myself. My name is Rob, I'm 25 years old.
I'm currently in London, but have plans to move to Frigiliana in April.

The reason for my move is just because the idea came along [long standing reason involving girlfriends parents love of the area] and as I'm still young, me and the missus thought we'd see if we could make it living in Spain???
So it's basically a bit of a test, which we hope will work out.

The first main problem that I think I'm going to have, but I'm practising alot on, is the language.
When you guys and gals first moved to Spain, did you already speak Spanish? If not can you speak it now? Did it take you long to learn?

With just over 4 months to go, I'm listening to alot of coffeebreakspanish material (great podcast for learning Spanish) and some Nintendo "Spanish Coach" 'games.'
I'm thinking that alot of the words and pronounciations I will just pick up from trying to speak the lingo when in Spain, but is it easy to pick up?

Nice to meet you all too

[Retro P]

Hi Bob, it depends on what you are going to be doing for a living and what level of Spanish you want/require, if your profession demands a high level of Spanish then you'll need to be pretty fluent plus you'll need to learn the local dialect, I've had holiday homes here for more than twenty years and can get by on a reasonable day to day level, ie exchanging pleasantries, ordering from bars and restaurants, paying bills etc, on the other hand I would be unable to mainntain a conversation requiring technical knowledge, having said that I'm basically a tourist/holiday maker here so my small knowledge of the language is not an issue, you'll definitely need it though if you are in tending to work in a Spanish language orientated career, as I understand it Frigliana is a very nice area to live, I don't know what the prospects of employment are in that area though, welcome and good luck

[itsmoirob]

Hi Retro,

I'd like to have fluency with my Spanish. ie, as well as being able to swap pleasantries, ordering at bar, etc, also being able to have and hold conversations with locals.
At present the only time I speak Spanish is when I'm talking to myself along with the recorded learning material I have...
But it goes without saying, if you know the lingo it will help enormously, I just wanted to see how people have coped with the language barrier?

As for jobs, we are going to see what comes along.
We know that Frigiliana doesnt offer much in jobs. But we do know a few people who live in Frigiliana who are employed and have offered to help out, ie pass on CVs, word of mouth.
Then there is seasonal jobs in Nerja. (there is possibly a friend of the family looking to set up his own business, which I could always enquire about.) Or even Velez-Malaga.
Failing that there is always a lengthy drive in to Malaga.

As I say we are doing this as a bit of a test, so we are only travelling over light, with plenty of cash for long term rental.
But the main goal will be to try and make are lives there work out.

[silver]

The work will be more of a problem than the lingo...

[itsmoirob]

Well I best hope that I have no problem with the lingo then hadn't I! : ha

[dido72]

Hi Rob, it is georgeous here isn't it.

As Silver said the work will be much more of a problem than the language, I hardly spoke any Spanish when we first arrived (3 months ago) and even though I am picking it up daily I am far from fluent but it hasn't been a problem so far, there is even an English man working at the town hall, he is a star. Summer work is reasonably easy to come by but it's a struggle in winter, we have hardly worked at all since November but if you have some financial back up it's not too much of a problem .

All in all it's a fantastic life here, quiet at the moment but lively in summer and christmas and feria's etc. If you want it a bit more lively then Nerja is just down the road and you can have a fantastic night out there.

Get your self know around the village and in Nerja, make some contacts and you shouldn't have a problem finding at least temporary work.

Good luck with your move and enjoy it!

[karandjon]

Hi Rob. We used to live near Motril, about 1/2hr East of ****. I was 29 when i moved permanently (5 years ago), having spent only 3 months at Institute de Cevantes in Leeds, once a week, learning basic spanish.It was after 6 weeks of living here that i held my first 2 sentence conversation about the weather (with a guy in a bar in ****, actually).

I found that having to arrange builders, furniture, accounts, residency plus 101 other things to do with living in Spain, soon helped me on the way with the language.

One thing you may be interested in is that there is a school in Motril where extranjeros (foreigners) can learn spanish for free.It started in September.It is twice a week, in the evenings. I went for a year, and altho the lessons were hard going, the school was given a subsidy to take us out to the bar each evening after class, which is where i found i learnt the most!!My class consisted of 1 french,1 german,1 italian, 2 dutch, 2 romanian and myself, so the universal language for us all was our limited spanish.
If you´re interested in going, i can give you details of my friend who is learning there this year.

We´re fortunate to not have to work, and i will say I think you will find it very difficult, if not impossible to get "career" work in or around ****, without being completely fluent in Spanish.
With it still being relatively new to tourism (compared to costa del sol), you will probably find it very difficult to get bar work either, as there are no english speaking bars around there (that i know of.) I have been out of that area for 12months now, so things may have changed slightly.

Anyway, these are my thoughts on the subject for you. Basically, while the area around there is stunning & people friendly, if you are moving for good and needing to work, please be very careful, as i really think you´ll find it hard to get good work.(dont forget the wages are very low also, compared to UK).Have you thought of moving to one of the more English Speaking areas first, to help you practice your spanish &learning to intergrate slowly. Maybe a thought.

Anyway, whatever you decide to do, all the best to you both. My husband and I made the move and it is the best decision we ever made!

Buena Suerte!!

Karen

[palmtrees]

In answer to your question, sort of, yes and no.

Perhaps more helpfully, I should say that we had spent a few years on holiday in Spain (CDS mainly). We could ask for an ida y vuelta and lots of cervezas, vegetables, a camping pitch for the night. We practised our limited Spanish in a bar in Los Boliches (Fuengirola) and one of the bar staff said in beautiful English (this is ingrained in my memory) - " When you can speak Spanish as well as I can speak English I will have a conversation with you in Spanish."

A year later we were discussing the drought, the weather, agriculture etc - and you've guessed, it was in Spanish. I bought Linguaphone tapes (no ad intended, hope this is ok mods) and they were great for me. I still use them if I think I am falling behind.

When we bought here, we were lucky enough to buy next to Spanish neighbours and so we learned more Spanish VERY fast (complete with naff andalucian accent).

I can speak, read and write Spanish well enough. My partner speaks it, and reads some. He doesn't write Spanish though. The only people who don't understand us are the ones who choose not to. Doing the tapes worked for me, speaking to our neighbours worked for him, depends what sort of person you are.

He has worked for Spaniards, I haven't worked. My work is office-based so the requirement for fluency is so much greater.

It is very phonetic so speaking is easy, but the grammatical construction is strange (in my view). I agree with the people who say that it will be harder to pick up the work.

But good luck. Learn as much as you can before you come because it will still help you in your day to day life, and if you get a job, great.

[spanish_lad]

frigiliana is a lovely town.

my advice: save up as much as you can.. and i'm talking THOUSANDS not hundreds.

work will be DIFFICULT to find. i mean propa difficult. i dont mean just in frigiliana, i mean in spain generally.

what are you "trained for" ? advice no.2, get a trade, learn something. theres a mountain of builders etc here who used to be supermarket managers / work in shops / seen their brother lay a brick and thought they can do it..

frigiliana .. compared to where i live is a small town, where i live is vertually a city...and i find it hard to find work after 8 years and speaking almost fluent spanish...

i'd love to live in frigiliana, we were looking in nerja but couldnt afford it. .. at the moment i'm working with a spark, and am confident enough to start up on my own...but i dont think there would be enough work around there.

if i thought i could do it i'd move there in a second

[Don]

Welcome itsmoirob. A bit of French there ?
Not to disagree with anything above but Spain technically has many languages, including for example Catalan around Barcelona. The good part around here is you only need to worry about two. The "kings Spanish" as in Castillaño and the Andaluz you hear on the street and in the bars. If you speak castillaño you will be understood but dont expect the reply to be quite what you expect. The various areas of Andalucia speak quite differently as you find different accents towards Portugal and almost Spanglish in some places on the Costa del Sol. Pronunciation and intonation is crucial in Spanish as you can say exactly the same word and mean it nicely or very badly. We have tried many classes and courses and even they teach the language differently so it can get a bit confusing but the locals really appreciate it when you try Spanish. I found it worth learning well how to apologise in advance in my Spanish was bad but .....

Saludos.

[karandjon]

The only people who don't understand us are the ones who choose not to.

This is very very true!!! Even something as simple as giving your PO Box number to the woman behind the post office counter or crediting your mobile. If they dont want to understand you, they wont!!
My friend is Venezuelan and even she meets they occasional person who refuse to "understand" her!! Don´t let these minority put you off. I know it knocked my confidence the first few times I encountered one of these people, when i was first starting out! And Don is right...the slightest incorrect intonation and you are saying something else!!

Dont give up, tho, Rob. It is definitely worth the perseverance in learning.I really enjoy my conversations with the spanish people, talking for hours with neighbours, discussing lots of subjects under the sun (as long as its not nuclear physics,bio-chemistry and the such) . Well worth the effort.

Karen

[frank]

[quote="karandjon"][quote="palmtrees"]The only people who don't understand us are the ones who choose not to. [/quote]

Karen[/quote]

I'm sure there is a bit of that, but unless you are an incredibly gifted learner, I would think it is perfectly possible to have difficulties in being understood.
When you listen to a beginner speaking Spanish or English (and we have all been there!) is easy to see why they may have problems. I have listened to some people that have said they speak good Spanish, and frankly it's been pretty grim, an awful accent, totally lacking in correct grammar use,yet they might well wonder why someone has problems understanding them. We all have had problems understanding people trying to practice their English on us! I think for anyone that has a good level of Spanish, if you had recorded them talking as a novice, and played it back to them now, they'd be horrified at how bad they were, and at the time, they probably thought they were doing OK!
I think the OP will struggle with the language, given his current level and the classes that he is doing. I also think he'll struggle workwise, and as he hasn't mentioned a huge pot of money like Karanjon has to rely on, it ain't going to be easy! But best of luck to him, if he doesn't try, he'll never know.

[itsmoirob]

Hey thanks for the many replys,

dido72 - Yeah, Frigiliana is very nice. Really nice casas blancas and especially nice views. Very relaxed. Main reason why we want to live there. But we don't mind a little commute out to work. Although we do have some financial back up, we are hoping to be self sufficient.

karandjon - A place that offers free lessons sounds great. It's one thing trying to learn the language on my own, it's a whole different thing putting in to practice. I'll PM about those details.
re: the job. I'm not too fussed about "career" work at first. I'd prefer to get myself a little settled and used to the Spanish way of life and when comfortable aim for a "carrer" role. But until then someone has to serve those lucky to not work and spend all day in bars

Palmtrees - Thanks for the heads up on the warning about those who chose to "not understand my Spanish." I just hope its not because of my slight Scouse accent ha
But I'm hoping for Spanish speaking neighbours. I couldn't think of a better class room then being outside in the lazy evening Sun with a native speaker. (Fingers crossed that my wishful native neighbout speaks English too....)

Spanishlad - To be frank, I'm not trained for much. I'm trying to think of labour work as my last resort (only because it's something that I haven't done before).
But we'll have quite a few euros and we're a bit lucky as the accomodation will be paid for for a bit when we first arrive. I think the first major disadvantage we have though will be trying to find a reliable cheap motor.
But we've not invested everything in to the move, we're just going to cross are fingers and put the effort in at making it work.
Did you know Spanish before you moved there?

Don - Just to clarify any confusion, no there is no French. The nickname [itsmoirob] was given to me a while back and has stuck. Short story, but maybe for another time.
I'll have to keep my ears out for those Andalucian differences. But with the studying material I am using I am already coming across a few words that are close, but mean totally different things.

Frank - I agree, it's all abotu putting wht you've learnt in to practise. There have been some Spanish we have encountered while on holiday who have been happy to help correct our pronounciation on the few words we did know.

[Babby]

One thing around here to keep in mind is - if you apply for a job in Malaga, quite often the requirement is "must be resident in Malaga" and this comes up quite often, especially the good "career" jobs.

[dido72]

Rob I am moving to pastures new early next year so the house I am renting will be available, if you are interested I will PM you the details and you can come to see it if you like.

[karandjon]

The only people who don't understand us are the ones who choose not to.

Frank, i quite agree.However the point i was making (& I read palmtrees the same), is that there are the odd few, in the minority who do not want to understand, as in my earlier example, ie giving po box number to counter clark after 5 years living here is very basic stuff, yet there is always the odd one who says ¿que? 3 times then gets you to write it down!!Even spanish will tell you to forgive the ignorance of that "odd one", if they overhear it.
Thankfully these occasions are few and far between, but can be daunting when first setting out.Rule of thumb, ignore it and carry on!

[palmtrees]

Karen
You interpreted my comment spot-on. That was exactly what I meant, ie we've lived here long enough to be able to have reasonable conversations, probably with a terrible accent, but it's not the oona sir-vay-zah level we started out with. I am sure we were bad then, but at least we tried. And like you, I also agree with what Frank says.

But I wouldn't want itsmoirob or anyone else thinking of moving to take my comment out of context. These days it is a pretty rare occurence, and when we started there were always far more helpful Spaniards willing to try and understand than unhelpful ones. I hope that puts it more into perspective.

Incidentally itsmoirob you might want to amend your wishful thinking. In our experience only, we found the fact that our neighbours DIDN'T speak English one of the main reasons we learned (Andalucian) Spanish so quickly, particularly the local expressions and local words in common use.

I forgot to say I used tv (and later radio) to learn Spanish. People who are glued to British TV all the time tend to be the ones who don't have a good level of Spanish. When you can watch and understand Spanish TV (without subtitles) ie based on listening and the visual clues, you know you are improving. And when you can understand the radio - and sing along to the Spanish songs, you'll be doing a lot better than loads of others. Don't give up.

[katy]

People who are "glued" to UK TV all the time are the ones who tend to think spanish TV is cr*p.

[itsmoirob]

Babby, thanks for the heads up. Fingers crossed I don't come across too many of them.

Dido72, I wish I could afford to come over and check out the apartment. At the moment all of our monies are being saved up and we are doing most of are flat hunting online and using memory/friends for ideas about particualr areas (luckily Frigiliana isnt a large village)
But if the property is online to view we'll certainly take a look, I'll send you a PM.

When you can watch and understand Spanish TV (without subtitles) ie based on listening and the visual clues, you know you are improving.

One of my own training tips is to watch a favourite show (Seinfeld in most cases) that I know almost all lines to, in Spanish with English subtitiles so I can get a hang of the spoken word.

Katy, funnily enough one of the things the missus said to me was she was worried we wouldn't get Sky TV. I have said that we wouldnt need Sky TV as we would be either be watching Spanish TV, Spanish futbal or on the beach/sunbathing/in the pool.
But she, and to an extent myself, is hooked on Hollyoaks. Plus there are some good new TV shows that we are watching at present that we would hate to miss.

[Mowser]

Rob I am moving to pastures new early next year so the house I am renting will be available, if you are interested I will PM you the details and you can come to see it if you like.

You've just GOT here. Why are you going so soon?