Almanzora river valley houses

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BunnyAndBear
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Almanzora river valley houses

Postby BunnyAndBear » Sun Mar 20, 2022 6:01 pm

:wave: Hello, everybody,

Newbies here. My husband and I are about to retire in a year or so and the grand plan is to move to Spain. Right now browsing property ads just to see what the situation looks like. We don’t have any particular area in mind, just want it to be warm(ish) in winter and not too far from the sea, maybe within an hour drive.

Many houses in Almanzora river valley look as if the builders had seen our wish list long before it was even written. I googled the name and not too pleasant things came up. But those were from 10-15 years ago. And then Innovation 14 from around 5 years ago.

How is the situation now? Have they sorted out the documentation? And if so are the newly legalised houses ok to buy? I mean if they did cut the corners for legal stuff what about structural integrity, fire safety, electrical hazards, drinking water safety, etc? Do they check all of that when legalising the paperwork or just put a stamp and signature on the dotted line?

It’s pretty scary, I always thought that checking in the ayuntamiento was the correct thing to do but turns out the ayntamiento were the bad guys too. The advice in this forum here was to check the cadastre. I have a vague idea what it is but where to find it and what exactly I have to see in there? How does a perfectly ok house in cadastre look different from illegal one?

Thanks for any answers!

elusive
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Re: Almanzora river valley houses

Postby elusive » Sun Mar 20, 2022 7:40 pm

Cant advise re the questions just to make sure you are able to get a visa and know the process?

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Wicksey
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Re: Almanzora river valley houses

Postby Wicksey » Sun Mar 20, 2022 9:05 pm

You say you're in Luxembourg but are you British or EU citizens? As elusive said, that will affect your visa requirements for living here.

If you're looking at 'campo' (country) houses then as you've discovered, it's a bit of a minefield. From my own experience of living in the campo, we've never had a drinking water supply and the many houses we have seen built in the Torrox area never had any sort of building control involved. Many were built without planning permission and by unregistered builders and they basically seemed to make it up as they went along. I can only speak of my experiences in the 1996 - 2004 period of boom-time building free-for-all. Certainly around here now, many more small places are being built and extended without any permission, a bit like the old days.

Nowadays I believe that you would need to request that the house gets a DAFO which should ensure that it meets certain planning and other standards, such as having a septic tank. Good luck!

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costakid
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Re: Almanzora river valley houses

Postby costakid » Sun Mar 20, 2022 9:11 pm

A friend has a house in Garucha area. It was built by the Almanzora Grupo. Descent quality but urbanisation living if thats what you want. They also built lots of houses on golf courses and little coastal villages.

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dxf
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Re: Almanzora river valley houses

Postby dxf » Mon Mar 21, 2022 12:14 am

Hola,

There used to be an organisation called AUAN (Abusos Urbanisticos Almanzora - NO!) but it is now defunct. However the abogado that brought in the AFO laws still practices in Almeria - Gerado Vazquez and the retired President are still active in the area and can give excellent advice - Google "maura hillen auan" and follow the links.

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BunnyAndBear
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Re: Almanzora river valley houses

Postby BunnyAndBear » Mon Mar 21, 2022 2:14 am

Thank you for the answers! :D
Husband is British (Welsh) and I'm EU (Latvian), both residents of Luxembourg - Schengen area. For the beginning it should be enough. We start with second home in Spain, toes in the water, then we see as we go. We have been in Spain many times and all stitched together it would make a decent stretch of time but never paid attention to such details that are important now. I speak ok Spanish, he is learning.

I'll have a look for the abogado, thanks for pointers!

If places are being built and extended without any permission then is it just a matter of time when they will be bulldozed to the ground again? Sitting on a time bomb.

Other answers opened a new field of questions. Do I need to open a new topic for them?

Was already wondering how "urbanisation living" looks like. We would like to have neighbours, both Spanish and foreigners, best if they are there also in winter. We want to stay in Spain during winters.
Is urbanisation a name for a newly built area that is not campo and not a historic town or is it something like American HOA dictating how and when you are allowed to breath? Does the developer maintain control over the urbanisation after the houses are sold? If we do get a house in an urbanisation, do we own it 100% or some property rights stay with the urbanisation? Are we allowed to make any alterations? There seems to be big areas of all the same houses stretching for miles and miles, especially around Torrevieja-Elche. Really nobody tried to paint theirs different or plant something or whatever?

Can we have a dog in an urbanisation?

Would urbanisation house come with water and electricity from the net?

In campo you have your own well or you have to get the water from shop? I remember once in Spain I saw somebody drive to the shop with a few hundred litre water can in the car. Is there a water tap to fill those like in fuel station for gas? Can you drink well water? Do wells have enough water for a household use? Do they dry out?

Some ads specially mention there is electricity from network. So if they say "solar panels" but doesn't say "network" then we must be very careful?

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dxf
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Re: Almanzora river valley houses

Postby dxf » Mon Mar 21, 2022 6:09 am

Hola,

There are over 300,000 illegal houses in Andalucía; some urbanisations have been declared illegal but if a house has been built for six years or more, then “the law of administrative silence” applies and it can’t be pulled down but you need a solicitor’s advice before purchasing an illegal property. Under the new LISTA law, you can extend a house that has an AFO but again, you need advice before thinking about doing it – unless like many chancers, you are happy to do it and wait six years before you can breathe easy.

An urbanisation is normally a legal build of an area of house / shops / offices etc. In theory you should have an organisation with a president, secretary and treasurer that keeps a check on what happens but I have known some without such organisations. An urbanisation doesn’t have to be adopted by the council and in the normal way of things, a new urbanisation should keep a book of all that happens in the first ten years before applying for the urbanisation to be adopted – and then will pay money to the council for the maintenance of the area.

If you buy in an urbanisation then yes, you own the house although beware in the Almanzora area as AUAN was formed to fight for the right to correct paperwork etc. caused by illegal builds / urbanisations – hence they paid the AFO laws to be formed.

In some areas there are “white villages” where there are very strict rules about when you can paint your house and it must be white! Yes, normally you can have a dog / cat etc. An urbanisation doesn’t necessarily have all mains services but normally they do – however, it is something to check.

In my area, the water company has put standpipes for people for people to have drinking water as it is considered that the water table has been contaminated by “pozos negras” which are not septic tanks – a house with an AFO should have a proper septic tank. You can get your water tested to find the quality – ask in the local Farmacia. Some wells do dry out in summer and can have salt water!

As to electricity, it used to be a popular pastime to illegally connect a house to a nearby electric network but the electricity companies have tightened up on it – but it does still exist! Modern solar panels and batteries can be just as good as the mains and you would really have to “bone up” on solar before buying to ascertain the quality of living

Davexf

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Re: Almanzora river valley houses

Postby DannyB » Tue Mar 22, 2022 2:37 pm

Hi Davefx, in your very comprehensive answer you say that with an AFO you will now be able to extend. I can find plenty of references to being allowed to "reforma" as opposed to simple maintenance but nothing to suggest it goes as far as extensions. We have been pushing the "maintenance " a bit with so far no comeback (only 2 years till our 6 Yr grandfathering) but Mrs is dead keen on a second bathroom. I don't know why as she complains about cleaning the one we have!.
Anyway, do you have a definite source re the extension permission
Dan

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Re: Almanzora river valley houses

Postby El Cid » Tue Mar 22, 2022 2:41 pm

I was under the impression that a DAFO does NOT allow any changes after it has been issued.. I have seen an argument that you are better off buying without a DAFO and then making an extension and then getting the DAFO.

Sid

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dxf
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Re: Almanzora river valley houses

Postby dxf » Tue Mar 22, 2022 3:21 pm

Hola,

Whilst the original draft LISTA did not allow any property with an AFO to be extended, in the consultation period the text was altered to allow it. This is from memory from 2020 and the oracle to ask is Gerardo Vazquez http://www.almanzora-au.org/Recommended.php gives a telephone number and email address

Davexf

BunnyAndBear
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Re: Almanzora river valley houses

Postby BunnyAndBear » Fri Mar 25, 2022 2:49 pm

I think we keep exploring the area as a possibility. Thanks everyone! :thumbup:


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