Cyclists

Information and questions about driving in Andalucia, buying or importing cars and motorbikes plus legal issues surrounding taxes and licenses.
Beachcomber
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Re: Cyclists

Postby Beachcomber » Tue Oct 29, 2019 11:11 am

I grant them their rights when necessary but that doesn't mean I have to respect them. Respect is earned not demanded nor legislated for.

Paddy Pumpkin
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Re: Cyclists

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Tue Oct 29, 2019 11:42 am

peteroldracer wrote:It is a fact of normal human behaviour that good laws will mostly be obeyed, and bad laws not. I love watching the cycle road races - both on tv and live - but there is a big difference between a peloton on closed roads and the idiotic behaviour of groups of leisure cyclists. Why don't the same rules apply to say groups of joggers, or young men out for an unofficial car rally? Because it would be stupid, I suggest.


As a guest and not a citizen in this country I have no say in the laws as I cannot vote in any elections to law making parliaments. As such I do not get myself bothered about the merits of any law as I am powerless to change them.

The citizens of this nation have decided on the laws. In the case of the traffic laws relating to cyclists it seems from the drivers behaviour towards cyclists that by and large the citizens are in agreement with the law. So it would anecdotally seem that the guests are the only ones who consider the law stupid.

Regarding why the laws are not the same for joggers...they are. Joggers have right of passage in pedestrian areas...and pedestrian crossings.

The law is set to encourage and protect cyclists especially in urban areas. If you regard this as a bad law then I am lost for words

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peteroldracer
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Re: Cyclists

Postby peteroldracer » Tue Oct 29, 2019 11:45 am

Benal Pirate wrote:as cars are getting wider and roads stay the same width!

And round here there are lots of coffin-dodgers on those tricycles with a basket on the back - try getting past two of them when they creak along side by side at 4 kph!
When cyclists have some form of certificate of competence, and pay for the privilege of using the highways I will give a bit more respect.
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costakid
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Re: Cyclists

Postby costakid » Tue Oct 29, 2019 12:53 pm

Benal Pirate wrote:I cycled from Benalmadena to the cement factory( I'd seen the tower in the distance and wondered what it was - disappointing when I got there!) near Rincon, mostly along various paseos - nice and flat. I was v impressed with that side of town btw. And the speed I go wouldn't register on any police radar.

Maybe someone on here can tell me what has happened to the boardwalk running alongside the Parador golf course near Los Alamos - most of it has gone, which meant pushing the bike for about a km through sand!

Also I've read in the local press that a bridge is going to built over the Guardalhorce river - that'll be a great addition to the costa.


The bridge over the river is being constructed in Asturias now and will be shipped down in sections to be assembled here. Should be in place very soon. I agree the cementos factory is ugly but if you carry on past that there is a lovely ride through La Cala and into Rincon via the tunnels.

Benal Pirate
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Re: Cyclists

Postby Benal Pirate » Tue Oct 29, 2019 1:22 pm

@ costakid - Thanks for the update about the bridge. I'm not a regular cyclist so was pretty shattered by the time I got to the cement factory...and I've got to make the return journey! Thanks for the tip, I'll try that route but will take the train to Malaga first.

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peteroldracer
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Re: Cyclists

Postby peteroldracer » Tue Oct 29, 2019 2:21 pm

Benal Pirate wrote:I'll try that route

Just don't take 15 lycra-clad mates with you!
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Re: Cyclists

Postby Benal Pirate » Tue Oct 29, 2019 2:54 pm

well not in lycra anyway!

Paddy Pumpkin
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Re: Cyclists

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:25 pm

Beachcomber wrote:I grant them their rights when necessary but that doesn't mean I have to respect them. Respect is earned not demanded nor legislated for.


Personally I couldn't care less if you respect cyclists or not. My comment said respect their rights. Nothing about respect in general.

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Re: Cyclists

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:39 pm

peteroldracer wrote:
Benal Pirate wrote:as cars are getting wider and roads stay the same width!

And round here there are lots of coffin-dodgers on those tricycles with a basket on the back - try getting past two of them when they creak along side by side at 4 kph!
When cyclists have some form of certificate of competence, and pay for the privilege of using the highways I will give a bit more respect.


I have a certificate of competence called a drivers licence. I can be sanctioned for my behaviour on a bicycle and lose my driving licence.

You noted above that you think people ignore what they regard as bad laws. If all cyclists had a licence and paid road tax would they also be able to pick what they regard as bad laws so that they can ignore them?

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peteroldracer
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Re: Cyclists

Postby peteroldracer » Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:53 pm

Whatever the laws say too many cyclists are guilty of antisocial behaviour.
It is not illegal to smoke cigarettes in crowded areas, or have loud conversations close to others, but if people were more conscious of the affect their behaviour was having on others and showed them consideration the world might be a nicer place
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katy
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Re: Cyclists

Postby katy » Wed Oct 30, 2019 3:10 pm

Is it a EU law as it seems about the same as the new cyclist laws that came out recently in UK? Was a lot of comment locally as some of the B roads are scarcely wide enough for two cars. Would be impossible to ever pass them.

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gretch
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Re: Cyclists

Postby gretch » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:18 am

I was involved in road safety for many years, and at a lecture by a prominent policeman, he said that, “cyclists have more right to the road than motorists, in that motorist need a licence to drive, their car needs tax & insurance, and maybe an MOT, without any one of these, a motorist would be illegal, whereas a cyclist has the right to use the roads without any of these restrictions, just the same as horse riders, and pedestrians”.

So when saying, “cyclists should have things like licences, tax or insurance”, where do you draw the line, do we stop little Sally having a bike for Christmas, or the bloke that can’t afford a car, but cycles to work each day for a pittance, will he also have to pay for the privilege?

And then there are pedestrians, how do we deal with them; after all they are technically, road users?

Just a thought :think:
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country boy
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Re: Cyclists

Postby country boy » Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:55 pm

On our recent visits to the UK we have been appalled at the rudeness of cyclists to pedestrians on cycleways especially, is it not the law that a bike should have a bell fitted to be used as an audible warning? None seem to in England from our experience and you don't always here them coming. My wife was struck from behind on a towpath in Manchester by a very rude young male person.No apologies..just a gruff "I was expecting you to move" .

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Re: Cyclists

Postby Beachcomber » Thu Oct 31, 2019 1:11 pm

My wife has insurance for her horse that covers any damage it may cause whilst she is riding it on a public road. I wonder how many cyclists do? The horse is also registered with OCA at the cost of an annual fee.

What would have happened if Country Boy's wife had been seriously injured? At least in the UK she would have been treated by the NHS at the cost of the UK tax payer but the lycra lout cycles off without a care with no means of identifying him and probably no insurance anyway.

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Re: Cyclists

Postby katy » Thu Oct 31, 2019 2:38 pm

country boy wrote:On our recent visits to the UK we have been appalled at the rudeness of cyclists to pedestrians on cycleways especially, is it not the law that a bike should have a bell fitted to be used as an audible warning? None seem to in England from our experience and you don't always here them coming. My wife was struck from behind on a towpath in Manchester by a very rude young male person.No apologies..just a gruff "I was expecting you to move" .


Very true. Similar nearly happened to us. Country lane with lots of bends and we didn't hear it coming. Cyclist was travelling much faster than a car would on the lane. Some mobility scooters are a problem too. One ran into me on a traffic free area. Came up behind me, fortunately very slowly. Shortly afterwards she ran into a market stall and it all fell down. She looked a bit ga ga. So they should be insured.

Beachcomber
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Re: Cyclists

Postby Beachcomber » Thu Oct 31, 2019 2:57 pm

Are you sure it wasn't that nun on the mobility scooter from Off Their Rockers?

katy
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Re: Cyclists

Postby katy » Thu Oct 31, 2019 3:05 pm

Who is that?

One thing I have noticed around the lanes here if there are horse riders we keep our distance and when it is convenient they pull in to let us pass. We wave, they wave, sorted.

Beachcomber
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Re: Cyclists

Postby Beachcomber » Thu Oct 31, 2019 3:25 pm

My wife gives and receives the same courtesy when she is riding.

Off Their Rockers was an ITV programme like Candid Camera but with old people.

Paddy Pumpkin
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Re: Cyclists

Postby Paddy Pumpkin » Fri Nov 01, 2019 9:56 am

We could all sit here all day and tell anecdotes of bad road behaviour.

I, and all of my cycling friends, have an RFEC licence and have 3rd party insurance. I have had an accident and have witnessed several accidents involving my cycling friends and cars. Not one of thosee accidents have been caused by the cyclist and on each occasion the car insurance has paid out without question.

I see more dangerous behaviour from motorists than cyclists. The motorist has a more dangerous weapon than a cyclist or equestrianist. Hence they should have a higher standard of care and know the law. As is clear from my original reply there are many motorists who don't know the law and were not aware of the occasions upon which the law says the cyclist has the right of way, or that cyclist can cycle two abreast. I can only guess that many times motorists accuse cyclists of bad behaviour whilst it is the motorist who is in the wrong.

I state once again I am a motorist also covering about 20,000km per year so I see cyclists do the bad things just like you all do. However being a cyclist covering about 15,000 km per year I see the other side also.

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country boy
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Re: Cyclists

Postby country boy » Fri Nov 01, 2019 10:12 am

Mr Pumpkin, one question please.
Do you consider that all Bicycles should legally have to have a working bell fitted as an audible warning device for pedestrians and other road hazards?


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