Expired Residencia - new EU Cert

[Wicksey]

Wicksey wrote:
I meant that I wouldn't be able to get a UK one as I don't have an address there.

You don't have to have a UK address to get a UK passport so the same would have applied in the case of ID cards.

I am a British citizen so can get a passport, but now I am a non-resident in the UK I presume that I wouldn't be able to obtain an ID card.

It is nice not to be asked for identity in the UK everytime you spend a few quid.

Maybe that's why the credit card companies are losing millions? No identification needed.

I don't mind producing ID when I use my card as I see it as an additional security check. Unlike in France where my friend uses her partner's card and no-one ever notices that it is in a different name and for a Mr rather than a Miss

[katy]

It is nice not to be asked for identity in the UK everytime you spend a few quid.

Maybe that's why the credit card companies are losing millions? No identification needed.

Most credit card theft is done by cloning/internet etc. i think Spain had/has one of the highest incidences of CC fraud. The USA doesn't ask for identity either.

[Mowser]

katy. My point is that I am rather pleased that whenever I use my Debit card here, they ask for proof of identity. Hopefully - if I ever lose my card - it will be more difficult for someone else to use it.

[markwilding]

Enrique wrote:
Does a Spanish ID card have an address on it............

Passports don't so. Presumably the same applies to ID cards?

Spanish ID cards do but Spanish passports don't...I've just had a look at my son's

[John & Kath]

Wicksey wrote:
I meant that I wouldn't be able to get a UK one as I don't have an address there.

You don't have to have a UK address to get a UK passport so the same would have applied in the case of ID cards.

I am a British citizen so can get a passport, but as a non-resident in the UK I presume that I wouldn't be able to obtain an ID card.

It is nice not to be asked for identity in the UK everytime you spend a few quid.

Maybe that's why the credit card companies are losing millions? No identification needed.

I don't mind producing ID when I use my card as I see it as an additional security check. Unlike in France where my friend uses her partner's card and no-one ever notices that it is in a different name and for a Mr rather than a Miss

Kath and I were 2 of only 15,000 in the population of 60+m who managed to get British ID cards before they were abandoned for British citizens on the pretext of cost saving. However this was pure bulls**t. The centers set up to start the operation are still in use since all non EU citizens residing in UK are made to have and carry a UK ID card!

The odd thing is that no one seems to have told Spain that our cards are no longer valid so we use them whenever asked for ID there is no expiry date. They look just like Spanish or Irish ID cards so I assume they conform to some EU standard.

If the last Government had had the sense to offer them to overseas citizens at the outset and non- UK citizens as a requirement then a lot better response may have ensued.

[knowal]

The certificates do not expire - they are talking rubbish - again!

It's one of the more annoying things to me, here in Spain, that officialdom do not know of what they speak. Unfortunately, this lack of knowledge of the law runs through the ayuntamientos, the Guardia Civil and land registry offices, too.
I was told at the Police Station where I got my Certificate that it will never expire.

The exception to that rule is if any of your personal details change such as a change of address - then you have to update the records and pay the fee again.
Sid

Where did you get that information from, Sid? Once a person has registered, they have complied with the law. Perhaps that is what the officials will say as they have to keep the bureaucracy machine turning with a few more €10.20's for a useless form, (or card).

[John & Kath]

El Cid wrote:
It's up to the UK government to issue ID cards and they refuse to do so.

Because there is no requirement in law for people to carry official ID in the UK. You can hardly blame the UK Government for the requirements of Spanish law.

There definitly is and ID cards are compulsory for all non-British citizens resident in UK and they must be carried and can be demanded by the relevent authority.

[El Cid]

The exception to that rule is if any of your personal details change such as a change of address - then you have to update the records and pay the fee again.
Sid

Where did you get that information from, Sid? Once a person has registered, they have complied with the law. Perhaps that is what the officials will say as they have to keep the bureaucracy machine turning with a few more €10.20's for a useless form, (or card).

The application form has a specific section for changes to personal details, such as your address.

If it was not a requirement to apply for a new certificate when your details changed there would not be a section to enable you to do this.

There would be no point in keeping a register of foreigners living in Spain if you did not have an accurate address for them.

When I moved a few years ago I had to get a new residencia card.

Sid

[markwilding]

There definitly is and ID cards are compulsory for all non-British citizens resident in UK and they must be carried and can be demanded by the relevent authority.

Not sure about that. My wife didn't have to. As a EU national she was advised to register at a police station but she didn't have to, so she didn't.
Her Spanish ID expired and she didn't bother to renew it for years.

[knowal]

The exception to that rule is if any of your personal details change such as a change of address - then you have to update the records and pay the fee again.
Sid

Where did you get that information from, Sid? Once a person has registered, they have complied with the law. Perhaps that is what the officials will say as they have to keep the bureaucracy machine turning with a few more €10.20's for a useless form, (or card).

The application form has a specific section for changes to personal details, such as your address.

If it was not a requirement to apply for a new certificate when your details changed there would not be a section to enable you to do this.

There would be no point in keeping a register of foreigners living in Spain if you did not have an accurate address for them.

When I moved a few years ago I had to get a new residencia card.

Sid

With respect, they are all assumptions and inferences. I was hoping for a legal reference from you Sid. The reason I ask, is that once registered, the law has been complied with. EU regs say they can ask you to register ONCE only.

[El Cid]

There definitly is and ID cards are compulsory for all non-British citizens resident in UK and they must be carried and can be demanded by the relevent authority.

Make up your mind!

You earlier said this was a requirement for non EU citizens and now you are saying it's for non British citizens.

Sid

[masterob]

El Cid wrote:
But even if they had gone ahead they would not have been available to non UK residents!

Where does that come from? The ID cards were meant to be issued to British Citizens who could apply for them when they renewed their Passports.

[masterob]

John & Kath wrote

The centers set up to start the operation are still in use since all non EU citizens residing in UK are made to have and carry a UK ID card!

There definitly is and ID cards are compulsory for all non-British citizens resident in UK and they must be carried and can be demanded by the relevent authority.

Sorry but you are wrong. There is no longer an ID card issued by the UK for non-British citizens! Certain non-EU citizens are required to have biometric residence permits when they wish to extend their leave to remain or apply for indefinite leave to remain in the UK.

You might like to browse the UK Border Agency web site which has a lot of information on all of this.

[John & Kath]

There definitly is and ID cards are compulsory for all non-British citizens resident in UK and they must be carried and can be demanded by the relevent authority.

Not sure about that. My wife didn't have to. As a EU national she was advised to register at a police station but she didn't have to, so she didn't.
Her Spanish ID expired and she didn't bother to renew it for years.

I suppose it is because all EU EAA citizens are supposed to be in possession of their own National ID card so no need to get one from UK. AFAIK UK is the only EU EAA country not having a IDcard system.

[El Cid]

El Cid wrote:
But even if they had gone ahead they would not have been available to non UK residents!

Where does that come from? The ID cards were meant to be issued to British Citizens who could apply for them when they renewed their Passports.

They definitely were not going to be issued to non residents. I have an email from the relevant office to that effect as I raised the issue with them at the time.

Sid

[El Cid]

With respect, they are all assumptions and inferences. I was hoping for a legal reference from you Sid. The reason I ask, is that once registered, the law has been complied with. EU regs say they can ask you to register ONCE only.

Here's the relevant reference.

http://www.boe.es/boe/dias/2007/02/28/p ... -08566.pdf

"Los interesados deberán comunicar los eventuales cambios de circunstancias referidos a su
nacionalidad, estado civil o domicilio a la Oficina de Extranjeros de la provincia donde residan o, en su defecto, a la Comisaría de Policía correspondiente."

Sid

[markwilding]

I suppose it is because all EU EAA citizens are supposed to be in possession of their own National ID card so no need to get one from UK. AFAIK UK is the only EU EAA country not having a IDcard system.

Correct me if I'm wrong but Ireland doesn't have one either.
I'm not questioning the need for an ID card,which isn't compulsory because a passport can be used as well,to enter the UK.

[John & Kath]

I suppose it is because all EU EAA citizens are supposed to be in possession of their own National ID card so no need to get one from UK. AFAIK UK is the only EU EAA country not having a IDcard system.

Correct me if I'm wrong but Ireland doesn't have one either.
I'm not questioning the need for an ID card,which isn't compulsory because a passport can be used as well,to enter the UK.

Both my friends from Eire have ID cards issued by the Republic of Ireland and free passports as well. Coming from Ireland to England they do not need to use either.

[Mowser]

Coming from Ireland to England they do not need to use either

Do they need them if they go to Wales or Scotland?

[knowal]

With respect, they are all assumptions and inferences. I was hoping for a legal reference from you Sid. The reason I ask, is that once registered, the law has been complied with. EU regs say they can ask you to register ONCE only.

Here's the relevant reference.

http://www.boe.es/boe/dias/2007/02/28/p ... -08566.pdf

"Los interesados deberán comunicar los eventuales cambios de circunstancias referidos a su
nacionalidad, estado civil o domicilio a la Oficina de Extranjeros de la provincia donde residan o, en su defecto, a la Comisaría de Policía correspondiente."

Sid

I think that we have differing understanding of this. I read it that the residency certificate remaining in force depends upon the continuation of the circumstances which allowed its issue. Moving from one address to another does not negate its issue, moving out of the country does. So does a change of nationality or marriage/divorce if it affects EU residency rights. Moving from Granada to Sevilla does not affect EU Spain residency rights. Even if you construed that PDF passage as you have, (which I believe to be incorrect) there is no requirement to any further payment.