Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

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vinuela vinny
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Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby vinuela vinny » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:29 am

Advice needed por favour.....

We have owned our house in Andalucia since 2004, and are non-resident with NIEs, currently staying there for less than 183 days in any rolling twelve months, have non-resident bank accounts, health insurance, contribute we guess around €20,000pa to the local economy, and pay all our taxes in both countries as required. Our domicile is in the UK, where we own our main home. Our driving licences are UK, and we have already sourced appropriate IDPs for after 1 January 2021

Our understanding is that after Brexit, we will only be able stay in Spain for 90 days in any rolling 180, and that on arrival in Spain we will have to be able to show that our planned return will be within the above criteria? And that we will not require a visa to do this? If so this will not cause us too much trouble, but the new requirements will impact on our past tendency to spend more time in Andalucia in the summer, and less in the winter months

We would however prefer not to change our previously somewhat casual and often otherwise unplanned visits, and we are exploring whether it might be possible to legally continue our previous lifestyle. The various options for visas do not seem to help, in that none seem appropriate for what we are, which in effect, is long term tourists

There must be many others in our situation, including those who are UK domiciled, but winter in Spain

We wondered if Forum experts think our understanding to be correct, and if so, how others might be resolving these issues please?

Thank you

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby costakid » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:50 am

You are right on the days aloud and it will effect 1000s like you and also us. Are situation mirrors yours but unfortunately after dec 31st it all changes. The only way around it is a golden visa but thats not affordable for most. I was told there may be some other type of travel visa but not sure if thats just bar talk.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby elusive » Sun Nov 22, 2020 1:23 pm

Currently theres no visas unless you are working or are a student and tbh i doubt that will change.i presume spain would have to leave the schengen to allow it?and it would have to be reprecipical which boris is hardly gonna agree to. Its the old thing of want freedom of movment then stay in the E.U.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby costakid » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:18 pm

The Op said they spend 20K a year in Spain along with thousands of others. I am sure Spain will try and work something out to retain that income. The Brits are the biggest spenders.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby El Cid » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:21 pm

It’s very difficult for them as they are bound by Schengen rules. I’m sure they will try if it’s at all possible. About the only option I can think of it to make Schengen extended vidas easier to get but it will still be a load of hassle and paperwork.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby dxf » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:15 pm

Hola,

It is not the arrival in Spain, nor the days in Spain, but in the Schengen area in total; So if you visit other EU countries it will count towards your 90 days - this may concern people who drive to Spain rather than fly.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby costakid » Mon Nov 23, 2020 11:27 am

Yes very true. I have to factor in the days I am in Germany and Belgium when on business although I do not go as often these days.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby vinuela vinny » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:21 pm

Thanks everyone for their helpful contributions - very grateful......

I have just received this from the Consulate in Madrid, and thought that it might be helpful to others -
The EU has confirmed that it will grant UK nationals visa-free travel to the EU after the end of the transition period. This means that UK nationals will not need a visa when travelling to the Schengen area for short stays of up to 90 days in every 180-day period. For longer stays, this will depend on the approach taken by the Member State/s you intend to visit. Spain has not yet confirmed what its arrangements will be for longer stays. Sign up to https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/spain for the latest information. Your 180-day period begins on the first day you enter the Schengen area. You may find this calculator a useful resource: https://ec.europa.eu/assets/home/visa-c ... tm?lang=en
So definitely no visas required for stays of up to 90 days in any 180, and the possibility that Spain may allow longer stays, although as El Cid mentioned earlier, they will be limited to what other Schengen and or EU states will agree.....

Masterly inactivity for a few weeks methinks, but any other contributions still welcomed.......

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby ashtondav » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:27 pm

It will be lovely to be able to collect European passport stamps once again.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby vinuela vinny » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:28 pm

Hmmmm......

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby dxf » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:35 pm

Hola

One of my members raised an interesting point; they have two British passports as they sometimes have to send the passport away to obtain a visa but need to continue travelling while their passport is away being stamped by a different country.

I will leave people to consider this point (Google is your friend)

Davexf
Last edited by dxf on Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby elusive » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:43 pm

How can you have two? Lose one,renew etc the other becomes invalid. Special public sector? Never heard of that.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby vinuela vinny » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:43 pm

Is that legal?

And presumably entry and exits will be recorded electronically rather than by paper, as I think they are now by the passport checks by the National Police in Spain and by the Border Force on entry to the UK? althougth I still find it interesting that there are no checks (other than the carrier?) when exiting the UK.......

Those with a 'dual nationality' and an EU passport from say Ireland may find it easier to stay longer in Schengen countries, than the rest of us......

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby katy » Mon Nov 23, 2020 2:08 pm

Probably there will be a Visa like America allows for most of the world. We had to apply for a B2 visa to stay 6 months in any one year. Any idea what US citizens have to do to stay in Spain?

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby katy » Mon Nov 23, 2020 2:14 pm

elusive wrote:
Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:43 pm
How can you have two? Lose one,renew etc the other becomes invalid. Special public sector? Never heard of that.
Some of my family had 2 passports due to travelling to Israel frequently. Depends on the reason.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby costakid » Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:01 pm

katy wrote:
Mon Nov 23, 2020 2:08 pm
Probably there will be a Visa like America allows for most of the world. We had to apply for a B2 visa to stay 6 months in any one year. Any idea what US citizens have to do to stay in Spain?

So the same as Spain. 90 in every 180 days equals 6 months a year.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby costakid » Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:02 pm

dxf wrote:
Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:35 pm
Hola

One of my members raised an interesting point; they have two British passports as they sometimes have to send the passport away to obtain a visa but need to continue travelling while their passport is away being stamped by a different country.

I will leave people to consider this point (Google is your friend)

Davexf
I think thats illegal unless they are diplomats or MI5.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby katy » Mon Nov 23, 2020 8:20 pm


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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby costakid » Mon Nov 23, 2020 10:03 pm

You learn something every day. Amazing init.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby irismary » Mon Nov 23, 2020 11:00 pm

I am resident in Spain, which, as I understand it, means that I can spend as much time as I want here, but that the 90 day rule still applies to the time I spend in the rest of the EU. The nearest airport is Faro, in Portugal. If I arrive there, presumably my passport will be scanned, and some computer will mark that date as the start of my 90 days. If I then come home to Spain, where I am legally resident, the computer won't know, as there are no border passport controls. If, after more than 90 days, I go back to Faro next time I travel, the computer will think I have overstayed! I could fly in via Sevilla, but it is two hours drive away, there are few flights to UK. from there, they are expensive, and they go to inconvenient hubs like Heathrow and Gatwick.
The same problem would be triggered if someone drove here. The computer would think you have been in, say, France all the time.
Have I got something wrong with my reading of the rules?


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