Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

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costakid
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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby costakid » Tue Nov 24, 2020 7:24 am

I think they will have the technology in place to avoid that but I suppose keep a list of all your travel docs/ tickets etc until things settle down just to be sure.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby dxf » Tue Nov 24, 2020 10:20 pm

irismary wrote: Mon Nov 23, 2020 11:00 pm I am resident in Spain, which, as I understand it, means that I can spend as much time as I want here, but that the 90 day rule still applies to the time I spend in the rest of the EU. The nearest airport is Faro, in Portugal. If I arrive there, presumably my passport will be scanned, and some computer will mark that date as the start of my 90 days. If I then come home to Spain, where I am legally resident, the computer won't know, as there are no border passport controls. If, after more than 90 days, I go back to Faro next time I travel, the computer will think I have overstayed! I could fly in via Sevilla, but it is two hours drive away, there are few flights to UK. from there, they are expensive, and they go to inconvenient hubs like Heathrow and Gatwick.
The same problem would be triggered if someone drove here. The computer would think you have been in, say, France all the time.
Have I got something wrong with my reading of the rules?
Hola

Yes I think so, if you enter or leave the Schengen area then your passport will be stamped. so if you travel from Faro to anywhere in the Schengen area, your passport will not be stamped but if you fly to the UK then it will be stamped and will be stamped again when you enter the Schengen area

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby Beachcomber » Mon Nov 30, 2020 7:54 pm

An article regarding this in the Daily Mail:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... l#comments

Predictably, the comments are not very sympathetic.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby costakid » Mon Nov 30, 2020 10:17 pm

I read that this morning. EU members can do 6 months in UK in 1 go but not the other way. I think the Spanish will have to do something about that, may do a 20 euro visa for Brits.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby El Cid » Mon Nov 30, 2020 10:32 pm

The reason for this is that the UK is not part of the Schengen area so they can do what they like with regard to the number of days you can stay in the UK. It has nothing to do with Brexit, they have offered 180 days for ages.

With regard to reciprocating this "deal", that is not easily possible because the 90/180 day rule is a Schengen rule and no individual Schengen state can change that unilaterally.

About the only thing Spain could do, if they wish; is making it easier to get an extended Schengen visa, but that was always difficult to get without exceptional circumstances (a holiday home is not an exceptional circumstance) and I doubt it would be easy to do that unilaterally. They would need the approval of all the Schengen countries and why would they agree?

I am sure the Spanish government are well aware of the lost revenue that is involved and will try and find a way round it, but don't hold your breath


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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby Miro » Tue Dec 01, 2020 2:34 am

I'd say it has everything to do with Brexit, when the DM headline shouts "EU's new post-Brexit travel rules"! (It's almost as if Brexiters didn't know beforehand)
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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby Wicksey » Tue Dec 01, 2020 10:50 am

I read a similar article in the DT the other day which stated that Portugal will be allowing Brits to stay 180 days without a visa, but of course you can spend that time there, but only in two lots of 90 days. It was not a well-written article. A lot of comments thought that you could go back to the UK for a few days then restart the 90 days abroad. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/advi ... rs-europe/

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby vinuela vinny » Tue Dec 01, 2020 11:44 am

Wicksey wrote: Tue Dec 01, 2020 10:50 am I read a similar article in the DT the other day which stated that Portugal will be allowing Brits to stay 180 days without a visa, but of course you can spend that time there, but only in two lots of 90 days. It was not a well-written article. A lot of comments thought that you could go back to the UK for a few days then restart the 90 days abroad. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/advi ... rs-europe/
As you say Wicksey, a less than well written article, and even worse in the Mail.....

And as for the comments, surely the same Schengen rules apply to Portugal as they do to Spain? And any suggestion of the 'blind eye' approach by the authorities or a 'fiddle' work around, doesn't really work either for anyone with a modicum of common sense? The only reasonable idea for me, has been a second passport from another EU country, for those lucky blighters who might qualify......

It seems to me after all the sensible comments on here (for which we thank you all), and on the 'Brexit in Spain' Facebook page, that only an EU wide approach will solve the basic problem? And despite the possible economic impact on southern EU countries, other states will likely want to protect the Schengen area, Macron will certainly want to show that the UK is being punished for leaving the EU to discourage others doing the same, and it will probably not be a priority for any of them.....

And we are now planning our future accordingly - so from 2021 we will likely be in Spain for a rolling two weeks late February, two weeks early April, four weeks May to June, four weeks July to August, and four weeks late October to November - which is good enough for us nowadays and seems to fit the legal requirements with not too much trouble, but little room for manoeuvre if we have any emergencies in Spain....... Any thoughts from other inveterate 'planners' would be welcome!

Heigh ho - life will go on.....

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby Wicksey » Tue Dec 01, 2020 12:13 pm

Let's hope Spain sorts out the need for PCR tests before your planned visits as they are expensive in the UK and an extra hassle at the moment, unless you are going to come overland through France. Even for us going to the Canaries last week we would have needed the antigen test before going, and that was an extra expense and a pain to try to get it done over the weekend before we were due to travel. The travel restrictions stopped us from going anyway in the end.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby Pamela1 » Tue Dec 01, 2020 12:37 pm

Ive no doubt those tests will be cast to one side as soon as the tourism season gets under way Wicksey..unless of course they are prepared to stick the last nail in the tourism sector which i very much doubt it after their tourism ministers and the oposition step in..

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby katy » Tue Dec 01, 2020 12:39 pm

Very true Wicksey. Some rogue Companies are not getting results back in time. Saw a lot of negative stories before we cancelled our last holiday. Then the test could be positive!

I don't think the 90 days stay will be much of a priority for Governments. Won't stop average tourism and second home owners are a minority. The rich will always get around it anyway.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby Miro » Tue Dec 01, 2020 2:29 pm

But....BLUE PASSPORTS! :crazy:
Don't worry about what people think, they don't do it very often

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby vinuela vinny » Tue Dec 01, 2020 2:38 pm

I feel so much better now......

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby costakid » Tue Dec 01, 2020 2:53 pm

The cheapest PCR test I could find was £99. I was online and calling private clinics all afternoon yesterday. The £99 is a 72 hour turn around so a bit too close to travel. A company in Stevenage are charging £170 for 48 hour service.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby costakid » Tue Dec 01, 2020 2:57 pm

katy wrote: Tue Dec 01, 2020 12:39 pm
I don't think the 90 days stay will be much of a priority for Governments. Won't stop average tourism and second home owners are a minority. The rich will always get around it anyway.
[/quote

Katy, that doesn’t make sense because someone staying for 3 or 4 months in their own home and paying into the system will spend much more than a family on holiday for 2 weeks once a year. I know how much we contribute to the Spanish cause and its a lot of money.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby katy » Tue Dec 01, 2020 2:58 pm

Another article in Telegraph today if able to read it. Mainly covers people's comments. Interesting comments about the comments too. One good point was that if it is so important to stay longer why not get a 6 months Visa. Some blame Theresa May for agreeing to allow 180 days in UK in the withdrawal agreement without obtaining reciprocal arrangements (she has obviously never done a business deal)'
But, Hey lets not turn this into another Brexit thread, we have left . Has been useful up to now without sarcastic comments

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/advi ... gniter-rhr

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby katy » Tue Dec 01, 2020 3:02 pm

costakid wrote: Tue Dec 01, 2020 2:53 pm The cheapest PCR test I could find was £99. I was online and calling private clinics all afternoon yesterday. The £99 is a 72 hour turn around so a bit too close to travel. A company in Stevenage are charging £170 for 48 hour service.
We looked at a lot before deciding to cancel Antigua. 72 hours is sensible but unworkable. BA recommended was £99. Some as much as £300+. Most guaranteeing quick turnaround but when reading the small print they all had a get out clause if late.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby alpineSi » Tue Dec 01, 2020 3:13 pm

Just a thought, but the Telegraph and Mail are dire on this and it's probably because they don't want to let their readers know what they conned them into. I'd recommend Simon Calder who writes for the Independent. Here's his latest:
Your arrival date in the Schengen Area – which covers most EU countries except Ireland, Croatia, Bulgaria, Cyprus and Romania – will be recorded by the Schengen Information System (SIS). This database is intended to ensure you comply with the requirement that the UK has signed up for: a maximum of 90 days’ stay in any 180.

For example, if you spend all of January in Spain, then return to the UK for a month, you will be able to go back to Spain (or any other Schengen Area country) for all of March and most of April. But from 29 April you must stay out of the Schengen Area until almost the end of June.

In general travellers who have reached their 90-day allowance are given three days’ grace. Any longer than that and they are likely to be handed an entry ban for one year. This applies throughout the Schengen Area – not just the country you overstayed in.

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby vinuela vinny » Tue Dec 01, 2020 3:25 pm

katy wrote: Tue Dec 01, 2020 2:58 pm Another article in Telegraph today if able to read it. Mainly covers people's comments. Interesting comments about the comments too. One good point was that if it is so important to stay longer why not get a 6 months Visa. Some blame Theresa May for agreeing to allow 180 days in UK in the withdrawal agreement without obtaining reciprocal arrangements (she has obviously never done a business deal)'
But, Hey lets not turn this into another Brexit thread, we have left . Has been useful up to now without sarcastic comments

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/advi ... gniter-rhr
Sorry, but I can't access the DT without paying their subs, even on these links......

Can you explain please your reference to a "six month" visa? My limited research didn't give me that option, other than the so-called Golden Visa which is unafforable for most of us, and the Non-Lucrative Visa which seems to be a pre-cursor to for us, unwanted residency, with the Student, Work, Au-Pair (I wish), Entreprenneur and Working Holiday Visas all involving me having to tell untruths, which is never a good place to start. Am I missing something, please?

Looking forward to uncrossing my arthritic fingers...... :thumbup:

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Re: Non-Resident 90 days in a rolling 180?

Postby vinuela vinny » Tue Dec 01, 2020 3:26 pm

alpineSi wrote: Tue Dec 01, 2020 3:13 pm Just a thought, but the Telegraph and Mail are dire on this and it's probably because they don't want to let their readers know what they conned them into. I'd recommend Simon Calder who writes for the Independent. Here's his latest:
Your arrival date in the Schengen Area – which covers most EU countries except Ireland, Croatia, Bulgaria, Cyprus and Romania – will be recorded by the Schengen Information System (SIS). This database is intended to ensure you comply with the requirement that the UK has signed up for: a maximum of 90 days’ stay in any 180.

For example, if you spend all of January in Spain, then return to the UK for a month, you will be able to go back to Spain (or any other Schengen Area country) for all of March and most of April. But from 29 April you must stay out of the Schengen Area until almost the end of June.

In general travellers who have reached their 90-day allowance are given three days’ grace. Any longer than that and they are likely to be handed an entry ban for one year. This applies throughout the Schengen Area – not just the country you overstayed in.
Seems about right to me......


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