Coronavirus

[Lavanda]

Sorry I posted the above link, really. It is hard to read the report because of all the, 'may be' 'so far' 'currently unclear' 'yet to be peer-reviewed' 'might change' 'promising indication' I can't go on. What is the point of the shouting headlines when the whole article is a pile of waffle?

[elusive]

Click bait

[katy]

external-content.duckduckgo.com.jpg

We are all getting brainwashed, some more than others. Watching a TV programme a few days ago it seemed strange that people were crowded together and some pecking each other on the cheek so I guess they have got to me too

[olive]

Stop press..... vaccine breakthrough.

Form disorderly lines please.

[Lavanda]

Slightly more sober report
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/11/ ... er-vaccine
When the share price jumped no doubt some people made a fortune having bought low and sold high. It's all about money.

[Lavanda]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/heal ... 19922.html

[Wicksey]

The Telegraph says that international trials on 43,500 people found the Pfizer vaccine prevented 90 per cent of coronavirus cases, with no safety concerns raised. However, on the TV news last night they pointed out that half of those were on a placebo as I understood it, so surely that means that only 21,750 people have actually had the vaccine, or have I misunderstood that? More details of the trial results will be published in 2 weeks. The vaccine needs to be kept and transported at -78 degrees which may prove problematic as I don't think local surgeries have that sort of equipment.

[Lavanda]

No you have understood it properly, Wicksey. Only 21,750 people have been used in the experiment. We do not know the mix of ages, genders, ethnic backgrounds etc but, for millions of people to be vaccinated the test sample is small.

Better not say too much as there is already some idiot in the Telegraph writing that being a vaccine-denier in public should be against the law. Hilarious but also just as Beachcomber has predicted ...

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/1 ... l-offence/

[elusive]

Aslong as the telegraph guy has it first maybe all journos and politicians aswell!!

[Wicksey]

So to say that the trials have been on 43,500 people is rather misleading then. As you say Lavanda, a fairly small sample of people have actually had it.

[katy]

Twitter and Facebook have said they will remove anti vac posts. There are plenty of other sites though. Lots of propaganda re. Lockdown on fora. Our local one is full of the wash hands etc. Lots on Twitter too.

[Wicksey]

https://english.elpais.com/society/2020 ... -2021.html

Spain's stance on it. It points out it will not be mandatory.

[Lavanda]

That is good that it will not be mandatory but, really, how could it be? I'm happy to not have it and let all the other, more vulnerable people, get in line before me.

[katy]

Slightly more sober report
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/11/ ... er-vaccine
When the share price jumped no doubt some people made a fortune having bought low and sold high. It's all about money.

Good for everyone though, our pension funds and airlines. We have done well since the first crash in March. Never invested in drug companies. Could go down again if the vaccine flops. I took out half of my profits yesterday just in case. Grandson hanging on.

[qe2ex]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/heal ... 19607.html

What I can never understand is why everyone is supposed to get vaccinated against anything. Surely, the people that want to be vaccinated and get vaccinated are protected and therefore can not get the disease from any unvaccinated person. It has never made sense to me.

Because some people can't safely take all necessary vaccines, for various reasons. Most commonly due to allergy I believe, but can be other reasons too.

In addition, not everyone reacts as expected to every vaccine. Your friend may get the same vaccine as you, but for some reason, the vaccine does not trigger the expected immune response in your friends body. If your friend later gets infected with the disease from a third friend, who "doesn't believe in vaccines", your friend may die, while you suffer no adverse effects. Had your third friend taken the vaccine, he would not have infected your friend, and your friend would not have died.

It's a bit like smoking. While you (not you specifically, but the "general you") may feel it should be up to you if you want to smoke or not, I don't smoke and I don't want you to smoke while sitting next to me in the cinema because your smoke affects my health too, not only your own.

[Lavanda]

Yes, that is usually the reason, but surely, the person who cannot take the vaccine ought to take care not to come into contact with whatever it is they are not able to be protected from? If we vaccinate 1000 people for every person who cannot be vaccinated in order to protect them and three of the vaccinated people suffer reactions that are life-changing then, instead of one ill person there are three. All this vaccination business sounds all right but it’s not that straightforward and open debate is getting impossible because antivaccine people are labelled crazy. I am NOT antivaccine for other people. They can have one a day if they like. Just my opinion and thoughts, that’s all.

[olive]

It looks as though Spain is getting 10 million doses of the miracle vaccine.

I still haven’t figured out whether this vaccine stops you getting and passing on CV19 or does it just stop you being ill. How long does immunity last? How many people do you need to vaccinate to achieve the holy grail of “ herd immunity”.

[Lavanda]

I don’t think we know any of that yet. Last word seemed to be that it helps your body fight the virus but only lasts for six months and that the vaccine consists of two jabs some time apart. Nothing seems concrete yet. There is a helpful chart in this article.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/1 ... s-vaccine/

[qe2ex]

Yes, that is usually the reason, but surely, the person who cannot take the vaccine ought to take care not to come into contact with whatever it is they are not able to be protected from? If we vaccinate 1000 people for every person who cannot be vaccinated in order to protect them and three of the vaccinated people suffer reactions that are life-changing then, instead of one ill person there are three.

How do they do that? Do children that for some reason can not have a vaccine "self-quarantine" for their whole life? Not attend school, gym, etc., because there is a risk other children in their class, gym, etc. have "anti-vaccine parents" that may infect and kill them?

If a given vaccine affected people like you suggest, that vaccine would not be approved for general usage. Mistakes will always be made, and medicine has been withdrawn from the market as consequence, but the premise for a vaccine is that the risk of suffering any sort of comparable adverse side effect from the vaccine should be infinitesimal small, compared with what would happen if you got infected with the virus the vaccine is intended to protect you from.

[firsttango]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ccine.html